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  1. #201
    Senior Member Darjur's Avatar
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    I'm sorry, but a lot of this thread seems "a little" paranoid to me. I know that I probably sound illogical and hypocritical from my view point, but to me it looks like the cold war propaganda restarted and that the things that are discussed are mostly just the extreme ends of the spectrum.

    While I don't have the patience to read 20pages at a go at 3am, I would like to make one thing clear that I see beign repeated over and over again. Socialist reforms do not make people go "oh I don't need to work, I can be lazy now and it's not like there's any incentive to reach for higher grounds."

    It also seems like you don't realize a few things. Abolishing taxes in essence destroys all rates in countries development except that of "the billionaires club". I'd personally rather live in a country with a >80% tax rate, than a 0% one. Pure capitalism is just as bad as pure communism if not worse if you look at statistics.

  2. #202
    Senior Member dga's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eldanen View Post
    I think that in the event of famine people would resort to helping eachother (family, friends) rather than turning to the government. Even strangers can have filial attachments.
    well, given the fema response during bush's reign, it is not the worst idea to assume that federal assistance will be inadequate.

    However, why does it have to come to absolute disaster for neighbors to be willing to help each other?

  3. #203
    Arcesso pulli gingerios! Eldanen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dga View Post
    well, given the fema response during bush's reign, it is not the worst idea to assume that federal assistance will be inadequate.

    However, why does it have to come to absolute disaster for neighbors to be willing to help each other?
    Because people don't care.

  4. #204
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Eldanen View Post
    Because people don't care.
    And people don't care because societies have become so large that there's no emotional investment. Look at the difference in attitudes between small towns and big cities for evidence of this.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  5. #205
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by dga View Post
    however, logic would imply that if parents choose not to (personal survival) or cannot feed their kids, their kids would go hungry. The options of the kids would be to beg from the local community, steal, or be afforded food by some govt program that taxpayers pay for. I dont expect inner city kids to start a farm, do you?
    My point, that you fail to realize, is that I believe government programs have nothing to do with the reduction in deaths from starvation. It's our economic success that makes food plentiful and cheap, making it exceedingly difficult to starve in this country.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  6. #206
    Arcesso pulli gingerios! Eldanen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    And people don't care because societies have become so large that there's no emotional investment. Look at the difference in attitudes between small towns and big cities for evidence of this.
    Of course, I live outside a small town (10-15 minutes), and I don't care either, lol.

  7. #207
    Senior Member bluebell's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    My point, that you fail to realize, is that I believe government programs have nothing to do with the reduction in deaths from starvation. It's our economic success that makes food plentiful and cheap, making it exceedingly difficult to starve in this country.
    So if food stamps were abolished, nobody would starve?
    ...so much smoke pouring out of each chromosome.

  8. #208
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluebell View Post
    So if food stamps were abolished, nobody would starve?
    No, (approximately) the same number of people would starve.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  9. #209
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    Quote Originally Posted by Darjur View Post
    I'd personally rather live in a country with a >80% tax rate, than a 0% one. Pure capitalism is just as bad as pure communism if not worse if you look at statistics.
    Could you define "Pure Capitalism"? Do you have any historical examples of a "Pure Capitalist" society? What statistical data are you referencing?

  10. #210
    Senior Member Darjur's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Silence11 View Post
    Could you define "Pure Capitalism"? Do you have any historical examples of a "Pure Capitalist" society? What statistical data are you referencing?
    I'm referencing to my intuition and reasoning. There had never been a pure "anything" country at all to take a real life example to take statistical data of.

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