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  1. #41
    Senior Member lowtech redneck's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    Blackmail! gave you the answer with which I fully agree. I am not from France but in my case it is also correct that only far right would consider supporting the Republicans.
    :rolli:

    The "far right" in Europe usually advocates centralized political systems and statist economic policies. They are often (unsurprisingly) extremely anti-American as well. The only real similarity I can perceive is that the "far right" is less likely than socialist elements to view religiosity and patriotism as moral and intellectual failings. The segments of Europe most likely to support Republicans in general are probably certain factions of the Liberal/Free Democrat and Christian Democrat/People's parties (not necessarily for the same reasons).

  2. #42
    Senior Member ptgatsby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowtech redneck View Post
    The segments of Europe most likely to support Republicans in general are probably certain factions of the Liberal/Free Democrat and Christian Democrat/People's parties (not necessarily for the same reasons).
    That doesn't seem to match up with the profiles of the countries that prefer republicans in this election (well, none of them do by quite a margin, but in terms of strength). If anything, it matches that those that prefer statist policies would prefer republicans.

    Having said that, I don't know of any studies that looked outside of the US for this, but given the preferences and profiles of each country polled and given that the statist preference continues to match republican voters in general, I would have to (marginally) side with the opposite.

    (This does not mean to imply that republicans are more or less statist, only that the belief that it is seems more likely - right wing being associated against military, defense, top down authority, obdience)

  3. #43
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    This sounds like a wonderful concept, but what do you specifically mean by "punishment?"

    There's not a great way (other than voting them out of office) to punish someone, and often it doesn't happen... and the NEXT guy does the same thing all over again!

    Largest two cases in point:
    1. Eliot Spitzer in New York stepped down as governor, after being caught in a prostitution ring. He had claimed to be a reformer, to clean up politics; he ended up doing the same thing he was claiming to fight.
    2. After Mark Foley stepped down in FL as a congressman in 2006 due to some evidence of homosexual liaisons and hanky-panky with young staffers and sexual harrassment, he was replaced by Tim Mahoney, who made a big deal about his family values and desire to clean things up -- who now has been seemingly caught in one sexual affair after another that he probably paid hush money to cover up... which of course he lies about, then admits to, then lies some more.

    We punish one guy, but they don't repent, really; and the next guy who vows to "clean things up" is just as bad. How can people be so STUPID first of all to be that openly hypocritical, and then to think they won't get caught? But they do it anyway.

    The "punishments" we give them aren't deterring the behavior, they just at best remove a loser from power... but even often that does not work.

    Will Obama be someone who needs to be "punished" at some point? He might have his flaws, but as far as a reason to vote for him (without saying whether McCain also fits the same bill): I don't think we're going to see these sorts of scandals from him. He doesn't seem to be a Type A "try to get away with murder" sort; he seems to be very open about what he wants and what he sees, and he's much more cerebral than carnal.
    Are you seriously suggesting that holding people accountable for their actions is worthless? That not doing so would do anything BUT encourage more of the behavior because nobody is going to get slapped down for it? If so, this is completely illogical.

  4. #44
    IRL is not real Cimarron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    Blackmail! gave you the answer with which I fully agree.
    He did not answer the question that I asked. He answered a different question.
    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one
    As for your original question, I think that people in the US are more or less aware of it but what they dont know (in general) is how much the rest of the world wants a Democrat(Obama) in the White house.
    And again, do you really think people in the U.S. don't know that? Why do you think that?
    You can't spell "justice" without ISTJ.

  5. #45
    Senior Member Eileen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Risen View Post
    Are you seriously suggesting that holding people accountable for their actions is worthless? That not doing so would do anything BUT encourage more of the behavior because nobody is going to get slapped down for it? If so, this is completely illogical.
    I think he's saying that it's hard to punish, not that it is pointless.
    INFJ

    "I can never be what I ought to be until you are what you ought to be. You can never be what you ought to be until I am what I ought to be. This is the interrelated structure of reality." -Martin Luther King, Jr.

  6. #46

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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    As for your original question, I think that people in the US are more or less aware of it but what they dont know (in general) is how much the rest of the world wants a Democrat(Obama) in the White house.
    Oh, they absolutely know that. They just don't care. And why should they? We're voting for president of the USA, not president of Earth. I can't imagine having the temerity to tell a citizen of another country how their election should turn out.
    Everybody have fun tonight. Everybody Wang Chung tonight.

    Johari
    /Nohari

  7. #47
    Senior Member Eileen's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EffEmDoubleyou View Post
    Oh, they absolutely know that. They just don't care. And why should they? We're voting for president of the USA, not president of Earth. I can't imagine having the temerity to tell a citizen of another country how their election should turn out.
    Well--they don't get a vote; nor should they. However, I think, given how much the USA affects everybody else, I don't think there's anything wrong with having an opinion (or voicing it).
    INFJ

    "I can never be what I ought to be until you are what you ought to be. You can never be what you ought to be until I am what I ought to be. This is the interrelated structure of reality." -Martin Luther King, Jr.

  8. #48

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    Quote Originally Posted by Eileen View Post
    Well--they don't get a vote; nor should they. However, I think, given how much the USA affects everybody else, I don't think there's anything wrong with having an opinion (or voicing it).
    I agree...but there is something strange about expecting your opinion to carry weight. If people with interests different from your own were urging you to make a certain decision, wouldn't you at the very least be wary of the motivations behind that opinion? I mean, most of the people voicing the opinions are from countries considered allies, but that doesn't mean that our interests are completely aligned.
    Everybody have fun tonight. Everybody Wang Chung tonight.

    Johari
    /Nohari

  9. #49
    IRL is not real Cimarron's Avatar
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    Well, all I've heard is opinions, not "you should"s, which I think is a fair boundary to have.

    Never mind, this is kind of nulled by your simultaneous post.
    You can't spell "justice" without ISTJ.

  10. #50
    Queen hunter Virtual ghost's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by lowtech redneck View Post
    :rolli:

    The "far right" in Europe usually advocates centralized political systems and statist economic policies. They are often (unsurprisingly) extremely anti-American as well. The only real similarity I can perceive is that the "far right" is less likely than socialist elements to view religiosity and patriotism as moral and intellectual failings. The segments of Europe most likely to support Republicans in general are probably certain factions of the Liberal/Free Democrat and Christian Democrat/People's parties (not necessarily for the same reasons).
    Probably we have communication problem here.
    I was judging on the basis of my own country and across the Europe it is probably similar situation. In my country the only side that is ready to support Republicans is the most conservative side on the "table" and people see it as far right. But for you the far right is a bunch of street bullys.

    Am I right?


    Quote Originally Posted by Cimarron View Post
    He did not answer the question that I asked. He answered a different question. And again, do you really think people in the U.S. don't know that? Why do you think that?
    I know he didn't, but I was pointing at the fact that I agree with him.

    You want to tell me that all Americans know that popularity of McCain in Europe is below 15% ? I am talking about all Americans not just about people on this forum.


    Quote Originally Posted by EffEmDoubleyou View Post
    Oh, they absolutely know that. They just don't care. And why should they? We're voting for president of the USA, not president of Earth. I can't imagine having the temerity to tell a citizen of another country how their election should turn out.
    That is because you don't live in any country, you live in USA.
    For example this elections are multiple times more impotant to people in my country then our own elections. Which is because this elections(yours) dictate what will happen to world market.
    Since just California has over 8 times the popualtion then my tiny country we base of our plans on this elections.
    It is something we must not overlook.

    Why do think the entire Europe is unifying?
    It is unifying mainly because we need to diminish impact of US elections on us.(and everything that goes with it)

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