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  1. #71
    Courage is immortality Valiant's Avatar
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    The United States are heading right for disaster. Sooner or later the politicians of said country will have tested the patience of the world a little too much and... Nothing good has ever come from extreme expansionist behavior, whether it's territorial or economic.
    Either some crazy taliban will dirty-nuke everything to pieces or a real country or alliance of countries will. The foreign policy and economic influence has really become too much for the world to accept willingly. Just look at the financial crisis... Who can say the U.S. is not to blame for the steep oil prices, the credit failure and everything that have followed in it's wake?

    Long live America... At least I hope so, but I don't think it'll last. Love the culture and the people, but not much more than that.

    I'd like to see the United States taking on a neutral role in world politics, much like Switzerland and Sweden. Meddling in other peoples' business is generally unhealthy; and don't give me the terrorist bullshit. Terrorists only exists because they disagree with your country's current politics. It may come as a total surprise to you, but it didn't start with them crashing planes into the World Trade Center. You took the fight to them way before that.

    Mightier than the tread of marching armies is the power of an idea whose time has come

  2. #72
    Order Now! pure_mercury's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by YourLocalJesus View Post
    Just look at the financial crisis... Who can say the U.S. is not to blame for the steep oil prices, the credit failure and everything that have followed in it's wake?

    I can say that the U.S. is not to blame for steep oil prices. Not more than any other country who buys oil, anyway. A lot of the blame for the financial crisis can be put on our federal government and bank executives, though. Fortunately (or unfortunately, if you're not big on globalization, a.k.a. "poor people getting richer"), the world's markets are so diversified and integrated now, that other countries can pick up the slack in bad times. On the downside, it means that risk can be spread out to hit everywhere, but one thing that has been proven in the last 100+ years is that free markets always bounce back and we end up richer than we ever were before.
    Who wants to try a bottle of merc's "Extroversion Olive Oil?"

  3. #73
    Courage is immortality Valiant's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by pure_mercury View Post
    I can say that the U.S. is not to blame for steep oil prices. Not more than any other country who buys oil, anyway. A lot of the blame for the financial crisis can be put on our federal government and bank executives, though.
    Federal government starts unnecessary wars => Oil prices goes sky-high => the world suffers.

    Bank guys goes greedy and gives too much credit => it ends up fucking up the entire global economy => the world suffers.


    Now, what I meant by what I wrote before is that the U.S. is trying to control world economics too much. Hell, I seriously doubt that it matters which party and president runs the United States, because every politician in your system is more or less backed by the financial sector. Thus under the direct influence of the corporate world. That makes the United States no better than one big and power-hungry corporation.

    As for free markets, I think they might be a good thing to some degree. But there must be a better system for it, with more regulations. Corporations should not be allowed to grow to become a state within the state like the oil companies have. The investment banks are a problem, too, in the sense that they create imbalance. They shouldn't be allowed to make huge decisions without running them past the senate or other instance.

    Mightier than the tread of marching armies is the power of an idea whose time has come

  4. #74
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by YourLocalJesus View Post
    Federal government starts unnecessary wars => Oil prices goes sky-high => the world suffers.
    The war didn't cause the oil speculation bubble.

    Federal Reserve makes credit too cheap => Bank guys do what bank guys do (totally predictable, the Federal Reserve should have seen this coming) => it ends up fucking up the entire global economy => the world suffers.
    Fixed.

    As for free markets, I think they might be a good thing to some degree. But there must be a better system for it, with more regulations. Corporations should not be allowed to grow to become a state within the state like the oil companies have. The investment banks are a problem, too, in the sense that they create imbalance. They shouldn't be allowed to make huge decisions without running them past the senate or other instance.
    Ugh, what makes you think that regulations are in the best interest of the citizens?

    What do you mean with "state within a state"? Oil companies don't have a police force enforcing laws.

    What makes you think that government can make better financial decisions than the private sector? If anything, they have less expertise and less information, making them less qualified to make any decision.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  5. #75
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    Quote Originally Posted by Misty_Mountain_Rose View Post
    Five Hundred Bucks says that IlyaK1986 is in this video somewhere:

    YouTube - Why people think Americans are stupid
    I'll take you up on that bet.

    Quote Originally Posted by YourLocalJesus View Post
    The United States are heading right for disaster. Sooner or later the politicians of said country will have tested the patience of the world a little too much and... Nothing good has ever come from extreme expansionist behavior, whether it's territorial or economic.
    Either some crazy taliban will dirty-nuke everything to pieces or a real country or alliance of countries will. The foreign policy and economic influence has really become too much for the world to accept willingly. Just look at the financial crisis... Who can say the U.S. is not to blame for the steep oil prices, the credit failure and everything that have followed in it's wake?

    Long live America... At least I hope so, but I don't think it'll last. Love the culture and the people, but not much more than that.

    I'd like to see the United States taking on a neutral role in world politics, much like Switzerland and Sweden. Meddling in other peoples' business is generally unhealthy; and don't give me the terrorist bullshit. Terrorists only exists because they disagree with your country's current politics. It may come as a total surprise to you, but it didn't start with them crashing planes into the World Trade Center. You took the fight to them way before that.
    1) Of course we will last, for this simple reason: the entire damn world is tied to us. If something goes wrong here, it goes twice as badly everywhere else. And the Arabs are especially dependent on us doing well, because if everything goes to shit, Dubai (the only non-oil Arab economy) goes to shit in a heartbeat. If we default on our debt, Saudi Arabia and China are fucked in one second, stock markets plummet worldwide, etc. etc. etc. etc.

    Study your history. When we had a run on our banks in 1929, the entire damn world crashed. Now that we have a home-brewed credit crisis by predatory lending, the entire world goes to hell again. We have a presence in every single world economy. If firms start having to meet redemptions and have to sell tons of assets in emerging economies, those economies collapse overnight.

    When America sneezes, the world catches the flu. Therefore, it's in the world's best interests to make sure that we're here to stay, or they're fucked far worse than we are. If we go down, NO nation will be left standing within a short time frame.

    2) The US can't take on a neutral role in politics since it's in our best interest to support Israel, and because there are a lot of very wealthy Jewish people and Christian gentiles that are EXTREMELY insistent on Israel's well-being, and any presidential candidate that insinuates he'll leave Israel high and dry can forget about coming close to winning the election.

    Now if the Palestinians and other Arabs would just fuck off and there'd be peace in the Middle East, then we could. But until then, we're very pro-Israel and very anti-rest-of-Middle-East. This is also why we need to get off Middle Eastern oil and see their economies bankrupt.

    Quote Originally Posted by YourLocalJesus View Post
    Federal government starts unnecessary wars => Oil prices goes sky-high => the world suffers.

    Bank guys goes greedy and gives too much credit => it ends up fucking up the entire global economy => the world suffers.


    Now, what I meant by what I wrote before is that the U.S. is trying to control world economics too much. Hell, I seriously doubt that it matters which party and president runs the United States, because every politician in your system is more or less backed by the financial sector. Thus under the direct influence of the corporate world. That makes the United States no better than one big and power-hungry corporation.

    As for free markets, I think they might be a good thing to some degree. But there must be a better system for it, with more regulations. Corporations should not be allowed to grow to become a state within the state like the oil companies have. The investment banks are a problem, too, in the sense that they create imbalance. They shouldn't be allowed to make huge decisions without running them past the senate or other instance.
    Great, you know the ugly truth behind our system. In order to do anything, you need money. Lots of it. So if any politician bites the hand that feeds them, their political opponents will have their political position in no time flat.

    As much as everyone loves to paint Wall Street as evil, Wall Street is the reason our country can function. They are the oil that greases our gears, and Wall Street is what allows tons of new ventures to take place that otherwise would never happen, since it connects those that generate risk to those that have the appetite to hold said risk, and make a profit off of that.

    Sure, it's the cool thing to bash the cabal of bankers that control everything (especially Goldman Sachs...they have plenty of alums in government, not to mention our current Secretary of the Treasury), but guess what? You're not going to unseat them. Especially because guess what? It's Goldman Sachs that's the democratic bank on Wall Street. So they're actually the good guys (that also got subprime right!).

    As for America controlling the world economy, hah. No. It's that we have a stable, thriving economy in the long run, and so, the dollar (along with the Yen...the currency of a nation we rebuilt from the ground up for a little while, which actually put our efforts to good use) is one of the safest currencies in the world, which is why all of the universal commodities are priced in dollars. And so, everyone bought into our economy for their own gains, and now, is along for the ride, for better or for worse.

    Edit: And if the world wanted to get off of the dollar, it'd take them too much trouble. By the time everything would be at the halfway point, we'd recover from our crisis and things will be back to normal while the rest of the world would be dependent on Europe's socialist economies. Not a good idea.
    Last edited by MacGuffin; 10-31-2008 at 12:38 PM. Reason: Merging 3 post(s)
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