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    Senior Member animenagai's Avatar
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    Default Intrinsic vs Instrumental value

    there are two types of value: instrumental and intrinsic. things with instrumental value are good because it serves a certain purpose. a chair is good because you can sit on it, a pen is good because it can write etc. an athiest would say the same about the bible. others have intrinsic value. these have value 'just because'. examples may include happiness, living etc. is this a mistake though? do anything really have intrinsic value? let's try and keep this conversation non-religious, as if two people disagree on a point when it comes to religion, we really can't come to any good conclusions based on a convo with the structure of 'yes it is!' 'no it's not!'. i'm quite interested to hear your views as i'm writing a thesis on this next year .

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    Senior Member Simplexity's Avatar
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    I would have to say intrinsic. I honestly cannot maintain interest or focus on things that have a certain finite value that is not completely determined individually. I think intrinsic value is the only motivational force that I abide by. I think it is because it will evolve as my mind does, I don't necessarily have to worry about boredom because I know my intrinsic motivation can handle the mental transformations and adaptations that my mind is notorious for.
    My cold, snide, intellectual life is just a veneer, behind which lies the plywood of loneliness.

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    Senior Member animenagai's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Aimahn View Post
    I would have to say intrinsic. I honestly cannot maintain interest or focus on things that have a certain finite value that is not completely determined individually. I think intrinsic value is the only motivational force that I abide by. I think it is because it will evolve as my mind does, I don't necessarily have to worry about boredom because I know my intrinsic motivation can handle the mental transformations and adaptations that my mind is notorious for.
    okay, what kind of things have intrinsic value for you?

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    Senior Member Simplexity's Avatar
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    See thats more of an Object - Subject orientation thing for me.

    I would say that I often personalize or internalize things that have an instrumental value. Thats not to say that I think the only way for something with an instrumental value to be valuable for me would be to internalize it though. I just think that I often like to internalize the things that are very important to me because it allows me to put my full devotion into it .

    Like when I played soccer that could be something that could be seen as having many instrumental values. For me, though, I would say that I just personally liked to explore and test my self on a physical level, while also having fun and getting a genuine sense of enjoyment just from playing. I was never the type to really like the "title" of being athletic or be the coaches favorite, star player, leading goal scorer, entitlement to a "team" even to practice formally to impress a coach or to show my commitment was something I never consciously did. I think if I were to analyze all of my passions and interests, heck even the things I've been successful with, I would say it was due to my internal drive.
    My cold, snide, intellectual life is just a veneer, behind which lies the plywood of loneliness.

  5. #5
    Senior Member Ilah's Avatar
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    I have lots of things that have only intrinsic value

    Art work and decorative objects provide the value of beauty and making my home seem more comfortable.

    Books provide entertainment, relaxation and intellectual stimulation.

    I have books of art that provide beauty and enjoyment and relaxation.

    Music is pleasing to the ear, improves the invironment and can help influence mood.

    My art supplies (including computer art programs) provide beauty and a sense of accomplishment of having created something.

    It isn't all about things I own:
    During lunch time I walk and take in the flowers, trees, water, etc. I suppose water may have some instumental value - shipping, home for fish, watering crops. The flowers and trees though provide pure intrinic value, beauty, sense of peacefulness.

    Ilah

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    Senior Member kuranes's Avatar
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    I think I can see both at play in the world, versus one or the other. I think some actual Art has an intrinsic value, for example, and can sometimes have instrumental value as well. Non-actual art ( when just speaking of art generally as a phenomenon, or potential thing that can be created ) is described as having at least an intrinsic value, because we think of examples of the actual when hypothetically commenting on it.
    "The people can always be brought to the bidding of the leaders. That is easy. All you have to do is tell them that they are being attacked and denounce the peacemakers for lack of patriotism, and exposing the country to danger. It works the same in any country."
    Reichsfuhrer Herman Goering at the Nuremburg trials.

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    I agree that it's a subject/object orientation issue. There are things that would have instrumental value, but actually have intrinsic value to me because of what they represent.

    For example, I have a book about cats. It has instrumental value because it gives me information about the species, and I can learn from it. It's also one of those mass-printed $5 books, so I presume I could sell it second-hand for maybe $2. But it has great intrinsic value to me because my Mom gave it to me for my 12th birthday (I still have it now, aged 23) and it was the only thing that my parents have ever given me for my birthday. Also, because I love cats (though I didn't tell them that) the fact that the book was about cats was significant. It is a symbol of my parents' love for me, and how they take note of little things, and make an effort to show that they care. If my house was on fire, between my laptop and that book, I'd grab the book. In a way, because of what it represents, it is part of me.

    So yeah. I don't think it's only things like "art" and "love" that have intrinsic value. I think that objects also have intrinsic value (sentimental value).

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