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  1. #181
    The Memes Justify the End EcK's Avatar
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    The problem is that most people are not philosophers, and in practice we need the assistance of revelation and religious experience to make ethics a living reality.
    No, the real problem is that idiots repeat what they've been told without even understanding how flawed their arguments are.

    If we needed religion to be moral individuals, atheist would all be monsters and religious people wouldn't kill, rape and so on or at least significantly less than the bad mean atheists, I think it wouldn't be too hard to made a case for the opposite statement in fact.

    More importantly, the big holy books like the bible contain a fuckload of contradictions, so obviously we use an external frame of reference to judge what is a 'metaphore' and what is actually to be taken litteraly.
    Expression of the post modern paradox : "For the love of god, religions are so full of shit"

    Theory is always superseded by Fact...
    ... In theory.

    “I’d hate to die twice. It’s so boring.”
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  2. #182
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    I think the point is that any moral belief requires some sort of arbitrary leap of faith.
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  3. #183
    Senior Member Kangol's Avatar
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    I was so ready to shit angry bricks of logic on this but it looks like the pile's already too high for my ass. A year too high. Perhaps a century too high.

  4. #184
    Senior Member Into It's Avatar
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    I didn't read any of what you said because it is late, sorry. I'm going to propose an idea anyway. Atheism is shallow because it makes no claims. I can at least make this claim in reference to myself. Some would say, "Well don't you claim that God didn't make the earth? Isn't that a claim?"

    I suppose that is a 'claim,' but I do not make it. I do not make it any more than I make the claim that my asshole created the earth. It does not reflect any of the information that I have gathered, so I do not claim that "God created the earth" any more than I would claim that Kermit the Frog did, or anything else that doesn't make sense.

    Contradictions don't exist. Never.

    So when we ask "silly" questions such as "Can God create a box so heavy that he cannot lift it?" we immediately disprove anything having infinite power.

    Atheism is shallow because there's nothing to say. At least that's how it works for me.
    An inscription above the gate to Hell:
    "Eternal Love also created me"

  5. #185
    actinomycetes raindancing's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheLastMohican View Post

    Being a theist is kind of a default position for many people, who are brought up into it. Most people aren't brought up to consider themselves atheists, so it implies some degree of personal intellectual and introspective thought when someone decides to be an agnostic/atheist.
    Browsing this thread, I was glad to see that someone else has expressed this statistical concept that is so often ignored.
    From my own personal experience: I was raised in America but now live in New Zealand (where my husband is from). My family group and their associations in America are all very religious, it is the accepted way to be, so what is said above certainly applies to them. However, my husband's family group and associations in New Zealand are the opposite. Everyone is an atheist, it is the accepted way to be. Similar stigmas are attached to non-atheists in this group as are attached to atheists in the Christian group.
    “Can a man of perception respect himself at all?”
    ― Fyodor Dostoyevsky

  6. #186
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Into It View Post
    I didn't read any of what you said because it is late, sorry. I'm going to propose an idea anyway. Atheism is shallow because it makes no claims. I can at least make this claim in reference to myself. Some would say, "Well don't you claim that God didn't make the earth? Isn't that a claim?"

    I suppose that is a 'claim,' but I do not make it. I do not make it any more than I make the claim that my asshole created the earth. It does not reflect any of the information that I have gathered, so I do not claim that "God created the earth" any more than I would claim that Kermit the Frog did, or anything else that doesn't make sense.

    Contradictions don't exist. Never.

    So when we ask "silly" questions such as "Can God create a box so heavy that he cannot lift it?" we immediately disprove anything having infinite power.

    Atheism is shallow because there's nothing to say. At least that's how it works for me.
    -1


    (stick to Fi)
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  7. #187
    See Right Through Me Bubbles's Avatar
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    I know this is a generalization of a lot of atheists and not them all entirely as a group? But I still feel the need to say that I find talking to a thought-provoking atheist a lot more fun than talking to a thought-provoking theist.

    It's the different views, and the force of critical thinking, it's kind of exhilarating.

    Iunno, I find the thread title misleading, as it refers to the entire (lack of) belief as a whole. Maybe "Why most modern atheists are so shallow" is more applicable?

    'Course, I'm nitpicking.
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  8. #188
    . Blank's Avatar
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    I only read the initial wall of text (read: skimmed through it,) and all I have to say is that the author is searching for deeper meaning into nothing and should just get over him/herself.

    "Oh! So there may be no inherent meaning or beautiful, objective truth behind everything! Oh, woe is me! I dislike some modern atheists' views because they cannot comprehend how beautiful the concept of God is and cannot create an equally beautiful alternative that I would like just as equally in its place! Oh, woe is me!"
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  9. #189
    Freshman Member simulatedworld's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blank View Post
    I only read the initial wall of text (read: skimmed through it,) and all I have to say is that the author is searching for deeper meaning into nothing and should just get over him/herself.

    "Oh! So there may be no inherent meaning or beautiful, objective truth behind everything! Oh, woe is me! I dislike some modern atheists' views because they cannot comprehend how beautiful the concept of God is and cannot create an equally beautiful alternative that I would like just as equally in its place! Oh, woe is me!"

    "But at least I can impress these people with my long-windedness and expansive vocabulary for 26 pages! Woooo!"
    If you could be anything you want, I bet you'd be disappointed--am I right?

  10. #190
    Senior Member Soar337's Avatar
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    It's easy to say that God is just a big lie that naive humans follow, that it has become human nature to want to believe that there is a higher power than us, somewhere up there, because we can't face the fact that we are completely alone in this world. But maybe atheists should stop wallowing in their own negativity and open up to the fact that their 'could' be something instead of cutting themselves off completely because they don't want to be let down, or follow a false lead.

    I find myself doing that a lot. I don't believe in the bible, but I don't call myself an Atheist because I'm still open to the idea that their could be something. There's still a certain amount of hope in me, maybe even my intuition telling me that there IS something.

    I think do believe in reincarnation. I'm just currently deciding whether a human's never ending cycle is their families, that their DNA lives on in a child. (Because EVERYTHING is a cycle. Just look at nature, the earth rotating, the food chain, etc etc.)

    But...I can still hope than humans DO reincarnate, and I never AM going to know until my time comes.
    Atheist don't KNOW that their isn't a God. As much as they would like to think.

    I hope I don't sound too soppy. My logical side has gone to sleep, much like I should be doing now.....
    <3

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