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  1. #171
    Senior Member LEGERdeMAIN's Avatar
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    Cannibalism is the answer to death. wait, wait...i mean, people should eat other people to keep emissions down. I think the quality of life would improve incredibly for the cannibals as the human population dwindles......death wouldn't matter as much if we lived better.
    “Some people will tell you that slow is good – but I’m here to tell you that fast is better. I’ve always believed this, in spite of the trouble it’s caused me. Being shot out of a cannon will always be better than being squeezed out of a tube. That is why God made fast motorcycles, Bubba…”


  2. #172
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ayoitsStepho View Post
    But the animals and other things on this Earth dont decide their purpose, so why do we? Simply because we can speak and think for ourselves? I'm saying [even though this may stray off the topic a bit] that i believe in something bigger than us, than who we are. I believe it is God. I have a sence of peace and calmness knowing that God is leading me to where I need to be. He know's my purpose, i cannot create my own. People as a whole are emotional and unable to make choices to actually choose their purpose in my mind. You'd have to be able to see the WHOLE picture of what happened, what is, and what's to come. We simply cant do that. No matter how smart or wise we think we are, we'll screw our 'purpose' up if we make it up, or heck, we'll even change our mind multiple times. Thats not a purpose. We're human, we're not perfect. We dont have the ablility to be perfect, no matter how hard we try. So why should we be in charge of our own purpose?
    Now I'm trying to be respectful here, forgive me if I err..

    I am slightly envious of your belief but I don't share it. If our purpose is determined by some being then why persist with evil? If this being is divine then surely either he/she/it is as warped as we are (hence our diverse purposes) or isn't in complete control.

    I realise that the official line is that you shouldn't challenge "the plan" but I'm afraid that, to me, is an excuse for not having a good reason.

    But before we get into the peaks and troughs of religion, what if you don't feel the divine? How do you reason your purpose? Is it purely a religious belief you hold or does it exist without the belief in a deity?

    (Oh and I definitely agree that complete understanding is beyond our reach, though I don't understand how that affects our purpose. Surely no purpose is objectively correct so they don't require complete understanding. No?)
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  3. #173
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTJMom View Post
    Well... whatever Englishmen do when they're ecstatically happy.
    Have a sweet cup of tea of course.
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  4. #174
    Shaman BlackCat's Avatar
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    The problem with death is that you're dead!

    But really, no matter what you believe or think, you'll know when you get there.
    () 9w8-3w4-7w6 tritype.

    sCueI (primary Inquisition)

  5. #175
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlackCat View Post
    The problem with death is that you're dead!

    But really, no matter what you believe or think, you'll know when you get there.
    Precisely...except that does not seem to be enough for many people and they spend half their life considering what will happen when their life ceases to be. I was just wondering on the sense of that.
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  6. #176
    Senior Member INTJMom's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    Precisely...except that does not seem to be enough for many people and they spend half their life considering what will happen when their life ceases to be. I was just wondering on the sense of that.
    The purpose of thinking about it ahead of time is preparation. Being a P though, that's probably why you aren't that interested in preparing ahead of time.

    If you're right... that there is nothing but nothingness after death... then you're right: it's foolish to waste time thinking about it or worrying about it.

    But what if you're wrong....

    ...then a pursuit of the Truth is in order.

  7. #177
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTJMom View Post
    The purpose of thinking about it ahead of time is preparation. Being a P though, that's probably why you aren't that interested in preparing ahead of time.

    If you're right... that there is nothing but nothingness after death... then you're right: it's foolish to waste time thinking about it or worrying about it.

    But what if you're wrong....

    ...then a pursuit of the Truth is in order.
    Nice try but I've already done that. The parameters are ill defined enough, the "facts" laced with assumption.

    I gave up on Socrates as a mad fool because he decided he'd understood the afterlife. It is my faith that belief or non belief in supreme beings and afterlife is irrelevant to life itself. I dislike the concept of getting judged at all but I wholly object to using that to enforce good behaviour. As a moral being I believe that to be good you must choose to be good without any provocation otherwise you are simply choosing to not resist. Ergo faith leaves me cold and science... well that's just faith but without the sense of community. I tried philosophy but instead of wisdom found a lot of people with tunnel vision. I think my current sense of faith is that life unfolds whether I decide to admit it or not and it will continue with or without me, past that I observe and consider trying not to claim that I understand too much.

    (okay that started simple but turned into my own philosophy... I shall leave it and hope it throws some light...)

    Edit - I will concede that perhaps my own wait and see approach is perhaps in part due to my comfortability with the unknown and compensating on the fly... However I would put it to you that cannot that be used as an example for those who like to predict?
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  8. #178
    Twerking & Lurking ayoitsStepho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Xander View Post
    Now I'm trying to be respectful here, forgive me if I err..

    I am slightly envious of your belief but I don't share it. If our purpose is determined by some being then why persist with evil? If this being is divine then surely either he/she/it is as warped as we are (hence our diverse purposes) or isn't in complete control.

    I realise that the official line is that you shouldn't challenge "the plan" but I'm afraid that, to me, is an excuse for not having a good reason.

    But before we get into the peaks and troughs of religion, what if you don't feel the divine? How do you reason your purpose? Is it purely a religious belief you hold or does it exist without the belief in a deity?

    (Oh and I definitely agree that complete understanding is beyond our reach, though I don't understand how that affects our purpose. Surely no purpose is objectively correct so they don't require complete understanding. No?)
    and thats completely fine. We both have different ideas as to what will happen after death. Different reasons and different ways we came to that conclussions.
    Actually yes i believe there's a plan. but i dont believe that im gonna keep on the course very well. i mean...really who can? if there was a plan that is. It gives me a better sence of calm to think theres a plan. that im not just wondering around here for no reason...or to just please people around me and then die ya know? And we're not going to know until we die of coarse. I suppose some would say that the 'plan' approach is just a crutch, but it allows me to live my life to the fullest and not regret anything because i believe its in some sort of plan. Of coarse im sure anyone could live that way and not think there's a plan.

    mmm everybody has a purpose i believe. whether or not you believe in a devine being or not. i suppose i just want to know why im here, whats it affecting and what will happen in the long run. God just seems to answer my questions and like i said before, puts me in peace. But we play a role [this is how i see it in my mind] why would i have a purpose and not someone who doesnt believe in the devine? we all affect eachother in some way that leads us to who we are and will be. that could lead us to our purposeful role or not. It is simply a way i see it :]

    oh and for the complete reasoning, i see a bit of a picture in my head. if we choose our purpose, then i see us all kind of bumping into eachother and running others over. but when someone/something is leading us we all run side by and in the right direction. in unison. like a well oiled machine.

    Let me know your thoughts :]
    Quote Originally Posted by MacGuffin View Post
    ayoitsStepho is becoming someone else. Actually her true self, a rite of passage.

  9. #179
    Lex Parsimoniae Xander's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ayoitsStepho View Post
    and thats completely fine. We both have different ideas as to what will happen after death. Different reasons and different ways we came to that conclussions.
    Actually yes i believe there's a plan. but i dont believe that im gonna keep on the course very well. i mean...really who can? if there was a plan that is. It gives me a better sence of calm to think theres a plan. that im not just wondering around here for no reason...or to just please people around me and then die ya know? And we're not going to know until we die of coarse. I suppose some would say that the 'plan' approach is just a crutch, but it allows me to live my life to the fullest and not regret anything because i believe its in some sort of plan. Of coarse im sure anyone could live that way and not think there's a plan.
    Wait you like the idea of a plan that you're not going to stick to?

    I'm probably being picky but I'm unfamiliar with being happy with a plan. That's a very J type of calm to my mind.
    Quote Originally Posted by ayoitsStepho View Post
    mmm everybody has a purpose i believe. whether or not you believe in a devine being or not. i suppose i just want to know why im here, whats it affecting and what will happen in the long run. God just seems to answer my questions and like i said before, puts me in peace. But we play a role [this is how i see it in my mind] why would i have a purpose and not someone who doesnt believe in the devine? we all affect eachother in some way that leads us to who we are and will be. that could lead us to our purposeful role or not. It is simply a way i see it :]

    oh and for the complete reasoning, i see a bit of a picture in my head. if we choose our purpose, then i see us all kind of bumping into eachother and running others over. but when someone/something is leading us we all run side by and in the right direction. in unison. like a well oiled machine.

    Let me know your thoughts :]
    If I read you right then one of your basic tenants is that there must be more to life than what is presented, yes? A nagging feeling that if you believe all that you see as you see it then you're missing something?

    If so then upon that we can agree. I guess then the main difference would be almost purely J vs P. I'm happy to leave it undefined and compensate as it arrives. I have little need and draw little comfort from trying to lay down rules. Now I say rules but what I should say is "such strongly defined parameters" because I've realised after having spent so much time around Js (my family is stacked with the little blighters) that no type no matter how certain they seem have rules. J's just simply extrovert their strong definitions...

    So yeah, agree. With one or two minor, tiny disagreements... (That's minor and tiny to an agnostic... you know like whether God exists... mere flippancies )
    Isn't it time for a colourful metaphor?

  10. #180
    Senior Member matmos's Avatar
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    Death. It's the body's way of calling it a day.

    I wouldn't worry about it. If you were around in the Bronze Age you'd be lucky to make 19; in Medieval England getting into your 30s would have been an achievement.

    Just think: you can smoke, drink, never exercise and eat like a pig and still get into your 50s & 60s. Lucky you.


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