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  1. #51
    Tenured roisterer SolitaryWalker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    Why create so narrow definitions?
    Why do you say that is not ok to kill people that have psychological sense?.
    The definition is such because we need to see what the essence of a human being is, and what demarcates a human being from an animal. It is clearly the ability to function cognitively on a certain level.

    This definition is perhaps narrow in some contexts, though as broad as it needs to be in order to depict the essence of man.

    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    Is it maybe because you don't like idea?
    What from the point of logic stops you from killing other people. You have said that you don't believe in mainstram version of god. If you are good planner nobody will ever know what to did. .
    I do not see the relevance.

    Quote Originally Posted by Antisocial one View Post
    Why not killing te infant, siblings , mother , father even grandparents if they are close. .
    Why do I have to repeat the same thing over and over again?
    Your relationship to those people is not relevant. It only matters whether or not they are able to function cognitively at a high enough level to be able to claim human rights.
    "Do not argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." -- Mark Twain

    “No man but a blockhead ever wrote, except for money.”---Samuel Johnson

    My blog: www.randommeanderings123.blogspot.com/

  2. #52
    On a mission Usehername's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack Flak View Post
    Then I apologize for my interference. I was under the impression most people got done with this low-thinking in childhood. Actually, I wasn't; I just deluded myself for a few minutes about the presence and general quality of the Average Mind again.
    I still don't get it. See above post of mine.
    *You don't have a soul. You are a Soul. You have a body.
    *Faith is the art of holding on to things your reason once accepted, despite your changing moods.
    C.S. Lewis

  3. #53
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueWing View Post
    What is the logical foundation of this argument?

    Scientific, or empirical foundation to my argument has already been discovered. We merely need to examine how the brain of a 2 year old works and what cognitive functions it capacitates him to perform. And respectively the brain of an infant, a fetus, and a retarded child.

    You're all set there.

    The judgment was not arbitrary, you need to re-read the OP more carefully.
    Perform at what level?
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  4. #54
    Tenured roisterer SolitaryWalker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Usehername View Post
    You people are all confusing me.

    Explain to me why it's so terrible of him make people think that abortion is no different than killing living babies? Because by doing so, he's arguing that abortion is wrong! I'm totally confused how this is riling everyone up.

    I don't believe in aborting babies. Yes, I agree with BlueWing's overarching point.


    My point seems to be the opposite of this. A baby or a fetus should not be regarded as a human being because they lack the aforementioned psychological sense of self.
    "Do not argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." -- Mark Twain

    “No man but a blockhead ever wrote, except for money.”---Samuel Johnson

    My blog: www.randommeanderings123.blogspot.com/

  5. #55
    Senior Member SillyGoose's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Usehername View Post
    You people are all confusing me.

    Explain to me why it's so terrible of him make people think that abortion is no different than killing living babies? Because by doing so, he's arguing that abortion is wrong! I'm totally confused how this is riling everyone up.

    I don't believe in aborting babies. Yes, I agree with BlueWing's overarching point.


    Because it's talking about killing babies!!!!

    It's just a gut reaction to a yucky subject.

    And I suspect that this is just a social experiment of BlueWings to further advance his theory of crazy NF's and their crazy feelings that shouldn't have any place in society.
    "My mom told me there was a weirdo on every bus, but I never could find him." Emo Phillips

  6. #56
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueWing View Post
    I dont get it. Just because you feel like they are human they are human? Do you maintain that Feelings are facts?

    What if I feel like there is a gremlin in my room who is trying to tie me down to my bed every time I attempt to get up and I cant go to work because of this? Is my employer obligated to buy this by the same token as one ought to buy your claim?
    The FACT is: Most of society agrees that after abortion is illegal on the child, there are laws to protect it until it is capable of making decisions for itself. I feel that way, and I argue with the point that way, but that is society's decisions as a whole. If society felt differently, they would change it. Whether that decision was made by feelings, or values, or otherwise, the law remains and satisfies the majority.

    If you said that, I would laugh and tell you get back to work!

    Whats to stop society from, in turn, raising the strict age later on after that were implemented? Let's start terminating old people with dementia, alzheimers, retarded folk, and everyone else in the world between the ages of 0 - 120 for that matter. There's too many flaws in your logic, and not enough facts based on who we can clearly consider capable of being human and functioning as one to have the rights as one.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    You are making an arbitrary judgment. What makes your arbitrary judgment better than anyone else's arbitrary judgment? I think the burden rests on your shoulders, here. Our society has already determined that the mother gets to choose whether or not her child has any rights, until birth, when that choice is no longer hers to make.

    I'd like to see some scientific evidence that shows your stance is beneficial to society, not some weak philosophical argument.


    Quote Originally Posted by Usehername View Post
    I think you're just being moody about it. If it makes people think, it makes people think.

    Which is arguably the point of the forum.
    Right. And after reading his point, I am arguing the fact that I believe he is wrong. And having a jolly time doing so.

  7. #57
    Tenured roisterer SolitaryWalker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lateralus View Post
    Perform at what level?
    At a level of basic intellectual cognition. For example, having a describable idea of the external physical environment. Being able to speak in full sentences. In short, basic intellectual functioning that are necessary to distinguish one from an animal and underline one's psychological status as that of a human being which is necessary for proclamation of human rights.

    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    The FACT is: Most of society agrees that after abortion is illegal on the child, there are laws to protect it until it is capable of making decisions for itself. I feel that way, and I argue with the point that way, but that is society's decisions as a whole. If society felt differently, they would change it. Whether that decision was made by feelings, or values, or otherwise, the law remains and satisfies the majority.

    If you said that, I would laugh and tell you get back to work!

    Whats to stop society from, in turn, raising the strict age later on after that were implemented? Let's start terminating old people with dementia, alzheimers, retarded folk, and everyone else in the world between the ages of 0 - 120 for that matter. There's too many flaws in your logic, and not enough facts based on who we can clearly consider capable of being human and functioning as one to have the rights as one.







    Right. And after reading his point, I am arguing the fact that I believe he is wrong. And having a jolly time doing so.

    Correct me if this is not an accurate interpretation of your view. Whatever people feel is right and agree upon goes, irrespectively of the rationale behind their decisions.
    "Do not argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." -- Mark Twain

    “No man but a blockhead ever wrote, except for money.”---Samuel Johnson

    My blog: www.randommeanderings123.blogspot.com/

  8. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by Usehername View Post
    You people are all confusing me.

    Explain to me why it's so terrible of him make people think that abortion is no different than killing living babies? Because by doing so, he's arguing that abortion is wrong! I'm totally confused how this is riling everyone up.

    I don't believe in aborting babies. Yes, I agree with BlueWing's overarching point.


    Believe it or not, that is exactly what I assumed his point was. I'm a bit perceptive: feel free to take my word for it. I stand by my statements: It's a ludicrous topic of discussion, and has no relevance to the issue. Silliness defined.

  9. #59
    On a mission Usehername's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Usehername View Post
    BW, your intent here is to enlighten pro-choice folks about the insignificant difference between a birthed and a yet-unbirthed baby, no?

    And thus everyone getting all upset at you should instead turn their emotions upon themselves and examine their personal abortion stance?
    Quote Originally Posted by BlueWing View Post
    Yes. They should not merely state their prejudices, but examine the logical foundations of their views. Almost certainly, after they have done this they will realize that laws concerning prohibition of infanticide and laws concerning prohibition of abortion by the same token (in some nations) are untenable.




    This attitude is incompatible with science and philosophy and is responsible for the ignorance in this world which in effect leads to much suffering. We have incurred many problems in this world because of our ignorance with regard to how the world works and how we must deal with it. The only way we can avoid being ignorant is by asking questions.
    Quote Originally Posted by BlueWing View Post
    My point seems to be the opposite of this. A baby or a fetus should not be regarded as a human being because they lack the aforementioned psychological sense of self.

    I am completely confused.


    What's the difference between you saying "Yes." to me first, and then saying "completely the opposite"?
    *You don't have a soul. You are a Soul. You have a body.
    *Faith is the art of holding on to things your reason once accepted, despite your changing moods.
    C.S. Lewis

  10. #60
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by BlueWing View Post
    At a level of basic intellectual cognition. For example, having a describable idea of the external physical environment. Being able to speak in full sentences. In short, basic intellectual functioning that are necessary to distinguish one from an animal and underline one's psychological status as that of a human being which is necessary for proclamation of human rights.
    Why is this level so important? What benefit would this give society? You do realize that the (ideal) purpose of law is that it benefits society, right? That would be the litmus test, if you ask me.
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

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