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  1. #661
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    Third thought: well, if something akin to experiencing "the Holy Spirit" counts as "seeing", that would be a very important caveat.

    I happened to experience something akin to what one might call "the Holy Spirit" last night, on my yoga mat, surrounded by 20-25 other people who likely were not experiencing the same thing as me at all. This by no means happens every time I am on my yoga mat, nor, when it does happen, does it necessarily last the entire time. But what I can tell you is that each and every time it has occurred, it happens to coincide with, and, in some sense, be the sustenance and fuel for, what I could only call the greatest, most beautiful, most graceful moments of my five-plus years practicing yoga: I perform the asanas better, I breathe better, I approach perfection. For whatever reason, in the rather rare moments this occurs, I feel like I am directly communicating with God/the Universe/Being.
    Hormones.

  2. #662
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    Hormones.
    :rolleyes2:

  3. #663
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    What did you expect me to say?

  4. #664
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    I didn't really expect anything, as I didn't really care...

  5. #665
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    I found this essay around the end of college.

    I strongly recommend it to anybody who's cared enough to participate in this thread.

    http://educ.jmu.edu//~omearawm/ph101willtobelieve.html

  6. #666
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    I found this essay around the end of college.

    I strongly recommend it to anybody who's cared enough to participate in this thread.

    http://educ.jmu.edu//~omearawm/ph101willtobelieve.html
    That is a very Te/Fi perspective. That is, the the idea that if truth is not something totally externally verifiable, that it is then a chosen subjective belief. It exalts the will.

    However, I believe that there is something not considered. There exist logical principles that people can be convinced represent truth, regardless of their personal feelings towards those principles. There also exist assumptions which are necessary in order to use most systems of logic, or function in everyday life. These assumptions are:

    1. The idea that our senses give us accurate data about the world around us.

    2. The idea that our minds are capable of perceiving the difference between reality and fantasy.

    3. The idea that there is a difference between reality and fantasy, and between accuracy and falsehood.

    One must either accept those assumptions, or behave as though they did, in order to function.

    The basic idea upon which all logical systems are founded, is that reality can be organized upon spectrums and dichotomies, because those are the only things which our logical minds are capable of processing. If reality is organized in any other way, then it is outside of our perception, and incomprehensible.

    What one believes to be truth, is not always chosen by the will, but is often derived from unconscious principles and assumptions that come from various sources... such a society, experience, and more. Some may even be biological in origin. We cannot choose to reject such principles with any degree of conviction, because some part of us would always see the rejection as absurd, even if we willed the rejection.

    Thus, while logical principles may not be totally objective, this does not validate the assumption that they are a product purely born of conscious will. There are such things as impersonal principles and ideas, that a person believes against their will, even if there are no such things as impersonal truths.

  7. #667
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    I didn't really expect anything, as I didn't really care...
    So many words and you are not interested in a response?

  8. #668
    `~~Philosoflying~~` SillySapienne's Avatar
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    This thread....

    Who necro'd it?
    `
    'Cause you can't handle me...

    "A lie is a lie even if everyone believes it. The truth is the truth even if nobody believes it." - David Stevens

    "That that is, is. That that is not, is not. Is that it? It is."

    Veritatem dies aperit

    Ride si sapis

    Intelligentle sparkles

  9. #669

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    Quote Originally Posted by Qlippoth View Post
    I can see it from your perspective, basically, "Yay for me". But as soon as it is quoted to a non-believer the meaning changes entirely.
    Yay for me? I dont understand. The character from the gospels who I believe is more similar to myself is doubting Thomas, I would have behaved the exact same way, although all the disciples proved cowardly in one way or another in the gospels and after, they were able to admit their faith wasnt all that even though they were there in person along with this guy who could perform miracles.

  10. #670

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    I cannot accept the word "blessed" being used to describe those with blind faith.

    Were the most readily believing followers of the Heaven's Gate cult blessed as well?
    And what do mean by blessed? And why would the believers of the heaven's gat cult be considered blessed?

    It is difficult to convey this in a manner which I believe will be understood but I'm going to try, its not entirely accurate but consider blessed to be "untroubled", it is not a blessing in the sense of favour or God's gratitude, since either being consequent of faith or devotion are absurd to a Christian who has been taught that those things are not earned by unconditional gifts. To be it is blessed in a sense like "bliss" or "blissful", it would appear a bit hippy to use the phrase "blissed out" but that is my understanding of it.

    Basically if you're not going to villify scriptures or its use by corrupt individuals you could be reading an entirely different book.

    I believe it's the part that says "you're going to hell if you don't believe this", even though there are plenty of other religious options out there (some of which claim the very same thing [and with equal "certainty"]), but none of which can actually provide more or better evidence of their actual Divinity than any other.
    Yeah, people tend to latch on to those sources sooner than the people saying that "living in hell in this life is no preparation for living in heaven in the afterlife" dont they? What's up with that?

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