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  1. #31
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinclair View Post
    Just as I would hesitate to paint sex as base, dirty, and animalistic, I would also hesitate to romanticize it and imply that affectionate and intimate sex is the ideal standard.
    Why? We don't have to build up impossible ideals surrounding sex to realize that it makes sense to have some affection for or at least trust in someone you are going to have sex with. The consequences of sex are serious enough that the pitfalls of not doing so should be obvious. Sex is certainly something physical that we have in common with other animals, but as with other such activities, our humanity has indeed made it into more than simply a means of procreation and satisfying primal physical urges.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  2. #32
    corona Hawthorne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    Why? We don't have to build up impossible ideals surrounding sex to realize that it makes sense to have some affection for or at least trust in someone you are going to have sex with. The consequences of sex are serious enough that the pitfalls of not doing so should be obvious. Sex is certainly something physical that we have in common with other animals, but as with other such activities, our humanity has indeed made it into more than simply a means of procreation and satisfying primal physical urges.
    Because it can result in one way of thinking being valued over another.

    Sure, most people probably prefer passionate, emotionally intimate sex but to make it the "better" way implies that the alternatives are lesser. Some people might just want release and find additional emotions overly complicated. Others might see sex as a means to end: to have a child. Imo, as long as everyone is on the same page, they're all valid motivations.

    There's nothing wrong with having a personal ideal but things always seem to get troublesome when they become publicly sanctioned values...

  3. #33
    Black Rose Krim13's Avatar
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    The world seems over sexualized and alien to me. An obsession. I would consider it something to be more personally cherished than flaunted in every day horny brainwashing and "sex = love" messages we get bombarded with. While the two go hand in hand often, they are not indistinguishable. Just about every movie has a sex scene, and many songs the singers or even dancers act as if they have little self respect, flaunting themselves.

    Don't even get me started on "Hannah Montana". . .

    Tis a procreative natural animalistic urge, sure. But things thrown around and over exposed upon too often starts to diminish it's meaning and valuablility. It becomes like a meaningless and predictable constant hunger constantly sated. It is better when something actually has more of a meaning.

    Something just doesn't sit well with me on it.
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  4. #34
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinclair View Post
    Because it can result in one way of thinking being valued over another.
    We do this all the time. In fact, if we did not, it would be impossible to choose one course of action over another. Note that I didn't present "passionate, emotionally intimate" sex as the only ideal. Without having that, you can still feel affection for your partner and trust in him or her. And yes, I think alternatives are lesser.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  5. #35
    corona Hawthorne's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    We do this all the time.
    Yep. Something something Human Nature (tm).

    In fact, if we did not, it would be impossible to choose one course of action over another
    Could argue this point but that would probably just be nit-picky and unnecessary so I won't.

    Note that I didn't present "passionate, emotionally intimate" sex as the only ideal. Without having that, you can still feel affection for your partner and trust in him or her. And yes, I think alternatives are lesser.
    From your original post, I got the impression that you were presenting a specific kind of sex and attraction as superior and I interpreted condemnation toward alternatives. Something like "people are having sex like this but if they were doing it like *this* things would be better". It wasn't clear to me if you were just expressing your own ideals or projecting them so I decided to comment on that.

  6. #36
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Sinclair View Post
    From your original post, I got the impression that you were presenting a specific kind of sex and attraction as superior and I interpreted condemnation toward alternatives. Something like "people are having sex like this but if they were doing it like *this* things would be better". It wasn't clear to me if you were just expressing your own ideals or projecting them so I decided to comment on that.
    I am projecting them. There are many areas in which I think some life choices are superior than others, pretty much for everyone, e.g. financial planning, health and fitness, and work ethic. I don't go around telling people what to do, though, since for the most part, their choices are not my business, and I place high value on personal autonomy.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  7. #37
    Black Rose Krim13's Avatar
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    It's called having standards.

    Something we need more of.

  8. #38
    Senior Member Retmeishka's Avatar
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    The developed world is obsessed with the idea of sex for nothing but pleasure, and never for procreation. The birth rate is plummeting below replacement in all developed nations. No one can have children because the cost of living is so high that it's impossible to live just as a single person, much less as a family with dependents who are legally forbidden to work at a job and earn money. (I don't want kids working as slave laborers either. I don't believe in the entire work-at-a-job-to-earn-money economic system at all.) Everyone's a slave, so all we can do is have sex for fun.

  9. #39
    Senior Member Retmeishka's Avatar
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    I also think that being 'scantily clad' (now that I'm reading some of the replies) should never be interpreted as sexual. I'm a nudist, and I believe nudity should be non-sexual. That means that all people are naked in public, regardless of sex/age/body type, regardless of how ugly or pretty they are, how fat or thin they are, or any other aspects of their physical bodies - everyone's body is accepted and ignored. You get used to seeing everybody naked and it has no association whatsoever with sex. People will still have sex when they are intimate with someone, the same way animals do. Animals don't get aroused by the mere sight of other animals just because those other animals are constantly naked. They get aroused if a female is in estrus, which happens at a particular season of the year. Humans get aroused by ovluating females too, once a month, when they smell their pheromones. Clothing should have nothing to do with it. People should not be constantly deprived of the sight of other human bodies, deprived of the opportunity to get used to them and take them for granted. When people make the transition, at first they are aroused at the sight of other naked people, but this quickly wears off, as they constantly see it everywhere, and their brains adjust quickly to the idea that nudity and sex have no connection whatsoever. That is how people live in nudist colonies. Your 'attractiveness' also has no connection with whether you should be allowed to be seen naked or not.

  10. #40
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    I'm not sure if sexualised is an issue so much as repression of sexuality as a legitimate part of being human. I think it stems from the fact sex looks so silly and the noises we make remind us that we are still just clever apes and for many that's a big hit to the self.

    The idea of dirty probably stems from this as well...'dirty' 'unclean' 'perverted' etc... because you're getting down and dirty, you're giving in to nature rather than repressing it under a pretence of superiority. On the other hand there are those who take it to a level of decadence that is harmful to themselves and others, which is another side to it where I can see a clear issue.

    That and STDs....or STIs or whatever it is now. But people shouldn't be scared into being safe, they should understand their potential freedoms within responsibility.

    Mix that up with ideologies, religious or otherwise and you have a nice big mess.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

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