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  1. #11
    Entertaining Cracker five sounds's Avatar
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    i have a lot of thoughts about this topic.

    sex itself of course is, at worst, neutral. it's a part of humanity and a beautiful part of it.

    culturally, i understand the importance of it as well. it's a universal and it's intimate as hell. it can connect people through art or discussion. it can help a young person or a person in an oppressive enviornment feel understood and validated.

    commercially, however, is where i start to have a huge problem. when natural human sexual desires are exploited in order to market products on a large scale, there is a very negative shift. now those same young people who need to see and hear about sexuality in order to understand their own are given a message that they are an object. or that sex is this glamorous, heightened experience that is to be desired above all else. that sex makes you happy, cool, loved, respected, desirable. and those are all lies. those are lies that our culture tells us to prey on our basic desires and turn them into insecurities, into a drive to consume products to obtain it or whatever glory it promises.

    and that's the fucked up part to me.
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  2. #12
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    I think it is what it is.

    There's other things in life and I dont even think that sex is the most important, the way the culture and social attitudes have fixated on sex is a little like some pre-adolescent which has heard big things but is yet to have sufficient experience to tell the reality from the fantasy.

    So I think there's too much fantasising and fixating, part of its sexual, a lot of its other things too, I think capitalism, libertarianism, trying to validate minorities through constant reform of anything displeasing them are fantasies too, examples of the same shit.

  3. #13
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hard View Post
    I don't think it's a problem. In reality though, it's more that I just don't care.

    So long as I am not forced to expected to act sexualized then it's "meh" to me.
    I think expectations for women in this regard are much stronger, especially in superficial matters like dress, appearance, and casual social behavior. Women who do not follow suit can be judged quite harshly, even/especially by other women. This judgment can serve as a forcing function, especially when something important is tied to it like one's livelihood.

    Quote Originally Posted by five sounds View Post
    commercially, however, is where i start to have a huge problem. when natural human sexual desires are exploited in order to market products on a large scale, there is a very negative shift. now those same young people who need to see and hear about sexuality in order to understand their own are given a message that they are an object. or that sex is this glamorous, heightened experience that is to be desired above all else. that sex makes you happy, cool, loved, respected, desirable. and those are all lies. those are lies that our culture tells us to prey on our basic desires and turn them into insecurities, into a drive to consume products to obtain it or whatever glory it promises.
    I agree with this. Exploiting sexuality in this manner is just emotional manipulation.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    Considering that, as animals on earth, our only purpose in life is to procreate, I would say the developed world in particular is almost comically desexualized.
    You're funny. As if sexuality could ever be decoupled from procreation.
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  4. #14
    . Blank's Avatar
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    I think about this topic kind of often too. It's kind of hard for me to articulate my thoughts clearly on this, but if you'll bear with me, I'll try to explain my response as concisely as I can.


    I think, for the most part, the developed world is sexually repressed. This repression in turn causes sexual frustration which creates a demand for sexual stimulation; however, much of this stimulation is based upon releasing the sexual tension. To do so, a person is likely to look at an object of desire--not as a person, but as an object. When people cease being people and become objects, it becomes pornography. Idols aren't people. They're objects. What we do to celebrities by taking away their personhood seems more pornographic to me than a hardcore film, but I digress from this tangent.

    What's worse is that if what one desires is considered taboo or even if it's just outside of the norm, it can create a lot of psychological stress, damage, and baggage for that person. These people can become even more repressed, more obsessed, and even more sexually frustrated, especially when they are bombarded with 'pornographic' images that don't appeal to their base nature. Many people in this group can come to resent themselves and/or others because of how highly sexual normalcy is placed upon our society's pedestal. For those interested, there's a really interesting VICE report (coming out) about gay conversion centers here.




    Maybe I can refine my thoughts into this statement: I think the developed world's notion of sex and sexuality is unhealthy. Perhaps it's not over-sexualization, but "pornogrification," or objectification of both sex and people that's the problem, so spreading the idea of unhealthy sex can qualify as being over-sexualized for this thread.
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  5. #15
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blank View Post
    Maybe I can refine my thoughts into this statement: I think the developed world's notion of sex and sexuality is unhealthy. Perhaps it's not over-sexualization, but "pornogrification," or objectification of both sex and people that's the problem, so spreading the idea of unhealthy sex can qualify as being over-sexualized for this thread.
    This. Exactly this.

    ~~~

    I don't think people typically, as a society, ever get sex truly right. Individuals seem to.. but then when we pull together, we come up with some crazy shit--like we can show butts and boobs galore as long as we don't show nipples and assholes, we can see men raping women but no females having pleasurable sex plz. We cannot show ankles and must be covered, but we'll marry and must be 'bedded' when we marry a man twice our age and barely out of childhood (I'm looking at you ancient rulers of the world). We should hook up and expect people to have sex before marriage, but if we're discovered we're suddenly whores. I never understood why society drew the lines it drew.. ever. I still don't.

    There was always something attractive to me about shows with these.. other civilizations lost, in another universe, planet, etc. where they are openly sexual without being bananas about it. Like it's a natural force not to be ashamed of, but still to be done with some responsibility. As a teenager, one of the biggest things that drew me to Paganism and Wicca was the freedom of TALKING about sex as if it was something awe-inspiring, wonderful, and useful to us both physically and spiritually beyond procreation or damnation of what-ifs and what-could-be's. It gave a great amount of weight in the responsibility of it, without shoving fire and brimstone down my throat, and also giving me a lot of hope of enjoying myself, and my partner. I was pretty thankful for that, and I still honor a lot of Wiccan schools of thought to this day merely because my roots in my sexuality started there. I was pretty lost before then.

    Do I think it's oversexualized? Yes. But not because the sex being shown is bad.. because the way they portray it is awful. Boobs are sex objects, and it's disgusting to see a mom breast feeding somehow in America? In Uganda they never gave it a second thought.. and no one just stared down a woman breastfeeding a kid--except my immature american buddies. Yet in America as long as they're shown for the pleasure of others it's fine. I don't see why the nipple is such an oversexualized part that needs protecting somehow as if the whole figure isn't a part of that. There is something dangerous about this very random emotional picking and choosing of what is acceptable or not on others. Why two women kissing on an award show is cool and risky and hot, but two men probably would not risk it. We show sex on TV on the daily.. but we don't want our children exposed to it somehow, as if they haven't been getting subtle signals for ages now. (In the show Vikings, it was a funny point in the show for the kid to say to his Uncle 'Oh, yeah.. they're not available right now, they're having sex.' so bluntly. But it is actually, to me, a really healthy thing. I think this stupid drama where kids are 'traumatized' by their parents partaking in sex is so silly and part of the prudish perversion pick-and-choose mentality that actually hurts everyone.) I cannot quite explain it, but I find it harmful and degrading for everyone the general atmosphere of the way people treat sex as a whole. And, usually, I find people are much much more reasonable as individuals.. yet in group settings it all goes bananas.

    ... However. I will say I prefer the way we have things now to puritan thoughts of women needing to cover up, men not being able to hold hands with each other, etc. etc.

    So in short. I am all for memes. I think they are truth telling, tiny snapshots of the state of mind on situations and they offer a lot of insight into situations. I like them, and generally support them even if the message is stupid. I particularly like SJW memes.
    Last edited by kyuuei; 02-27-2015 at 02:56 PM.
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  6. #16
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    No, the world is full of perverts

  7. #17
    Super Ape Luke O's Avatar
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    Hmm. I'm thinking about breasts.

    You know those parts of women's anatomies which evolved to feed babies, with a secondary function of being sexually alluring to others? In our world, it's not seen as a secondary function any more.

    I've met a few new mothers who refused to breastfeed because they think it's wrong, dirty, disgusting because they see their own breasts as sex objects above anything else. I know formula milk is good but it still doesn't compare to the real thing. Is this culture harming our children?

  8. #18
    Senior Member Frosty's Avatar
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    No not particularly. Sex is a natural biological function that I think just changes along with the times. Early civilizations had their own unique forms of it, their own restrictions, and their own processes, and as development occured and measures of acceptability changed, so did the degrees of sexualization.

    So I think that more or less that the levels in different civilizations are appropriately fluxuating- there is a certain unstated distinct window of standards that suits.
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  9. #19
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    People assign more to sex then they should. It's fun, enjoyable, feels good, creates a connection, etc. Its not immoral, status quo, make you a man, etc. To each their own, it's something between the people involved, not the world. Issue is it has been risen to a "this is how all of society should see sex" level instead of a to each their own and moved to a "social" level. It's overly controlled which makes it overly exploited.
    Im out, its been fun
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  10. #20
    Senior Member ceecee's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blank View Post
    I think about this topic kind of often too. It's kind of hard for me to articulate my thoughts clearly on this, but if you'll bear with me, I'll try to explain my response as concisely as I can.


    I think, for the most part, the developed world is sexually repressed. This repression in turn causes sexual frustration which creates a demand for sexual stimulation; however, much of this stimulation is based upon releasing the sexual tension. To do so, a person is likely to look at an object of desire--not as a person, but as an object. When people cease being people and become objects, it becomes pornography. Idols aren't people. They're objects. What we do to celebrities by taking away their personhood seems more pornographic to me than a hardcore film, but I digress from this tangent.

    What's worse is that if what one desires is considered taboo or even if it's just outside of the norm, it can create a lot of psychological stress, damage, and baggage for that person. These people can become even more repressed, more obsessed, and even more sexually frustrated, especially when they are bombarded with 'pornographic' images that don't appeal to their base nature. Many people in this group can come to resent themselves and/or others because of how highly sexual normalcy is placed upon our society's pedestal. For those interested, there's a really interesting VICE report (coming out) about gay conversion centers here.




    Maybe I can refine my thoughts into this statement: I think the developed world's notion of sex and sexuality is unhealthy. Perhaps it's not over-sexualization, but "pornogrification," or objectification of both sex and people that's the problem, so spreading the idea of unhealthy sex can qualify as being over-sexualized for this thread.
    This and especially the bolded.
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