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View Poll Results: What Religion Do You Practice/Not Practice and Why?

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  • I'm an atheist

    36 27.48%
  • I'm agnostic

    25 19.08%
  • Buddhism

    6 4.58%
  • Hinduism

    1 0.76%
  • Islam

    2 1.53%
  • Christianity

    39 29.77%
  • Other

    22 16.79%
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  1. #531
    Member DoctorCroupy#9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mole View Post
    It's fascinating that creativity is the content of the internet, and everyone and their dog is creative.

    Creative writing classes are everywhere, and we are all creative.

    But the content of the electric media merely distract our mind, while the medium itself goes to work changing our psyche.
    Oh, did you not create that particular description of secular humanism? I had never heard it described that way, so I figured you came up with it.

  2. #532
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoctorCroupy#9 View Post
    Oh, did you not create that particular description of secular humanism? I had never heard it described that way, so I figured you came up with it.
    I don't describe myself as a secular humanist, rather you have decided yourself to call me a secular humanist.

    I am Western, and the West is based on Ancient Greek philosophy, Judaism, Christianity, and the Enlightenment.

    I do understand though that the words secular humanist are politically loaded terms in the USA. But I don't share USA parochial politics.

  3. #533
    Senior Member Babybop's Avatar
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    I'm an agnostic who was raised Christian. I no longer practice Christianity for the following reasons:

    1. Like most religions, it promotes the concept of women being viewed as possessions rather than people, specifically in marriages. The majority of the bible seems to be written for men. Deuteronomy 5:1 states: "you shall not covet your neighbor's wife." There is no equivalent which states that a woman should not covet another woman's husband. Not to mention the "submit and obey" stuff.

    2. As a kid it was so easy to view Christianity as absolute truth because everyone around me either practiced it or was an atheist. There was no third option, just "believer" and "non-believer." In high school, I learned about other religions that are extremely common in other parts of the world; places in which Christianity has almost no presence at all. In my opinion, this diminishes its credibility. If it hasn't out-survived Shinto and Hinduism, how do we know it's any more true than those?

    3. I remember being annoyed at everyone at youth group because they refused to think for themselves. Specifically, there was one sermon in which the message was basically "lying is always wrong, even if it's to save someone's life." A few people in that group insisted that they would not associate themselves with a person who lied to save their life. I was 14 or 15 at the time, but I still found it ridiculous to view morality as totally objective.

    4. I can recall several instances in which I was saddened and/or outraged by supposedly moral atrocities in the bible, such as a man's entire family (including his children) being killed as a result of his actions, or someone being afflicted with a terrible disease for doing something immoral. Sitting in church, everyone around me seemed to be thinking, "oh yeah, God sure showed them!" but I was just shocked.
    Previous username: EliaBlack

  4. #534
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EliaBlack View Post
    I'm an agnostic who was raised Christian. I no longer practice Christianity for the following reasons:

    1. Like most religions, it promotes the concept of women being viewed as possessions rather than people, specifically in marriages. The majority of the bible seems to be written for men. Deuteronomy 5:1 states: "you shall not covet your neighbor's wife." There is no equivalent which states that a woman should not covet another woman's husband. Not to mention the "submit and obey" stuff.

    2. As a kid it was so easy to view Christianity as absolute truth because everyone around me either practiced it or was an atheist. There was no third option, just "believer" and "non-believer." In high school, I learned about other religions that are extremely common in other parts of the world; places in which Christianity has almost no presence at all. In my opinion, this diminishes its credibility. If it hasn't out-survived Shinto and Hinduism, how do we know it's any more true than those?

    3. I remember being annoyed at everyone at youth group because they refused to think for themselves. Specifically, there was one sermon in which the message was basically "lying is always wrong, even if it's to save someone's life." A few people in that group insisted that they would not associate themselves with a person who lied to save their life. I was 14 or 15 at the time, but I still found it ridiculous to view morality as totally objective.

    4. I can recall several instances in which I was saddened and/or outraged by supposedly moral atrocities in the bible, such as a man's entire family (including his children) being killed as a result of his actions, or someone being afflicted with a terrible disease for doing something immoral. Sitting in church, everyone around me seemed to be thinking, "oh yeah, God sure showed them!" but I was just shocked.
    I dont think most religions take that view of women, I dont think that christianity properly understood does either, nor the RCC which I'm a part of and practicing member, though increasingly its looking like an institution that wont survive.

    There have always been faiths besides those of the Judeo-Christian variety and I think there always will be, I do believe that the tradition I belong to is the correct one and would recommend it to others but I am fine with there being others in existence, the evangelical, fundamentalist and other exclusive and exclusionary traditions are not things I could ever subscribe to and consider they nye on heretical and displeasing to God but even if I did not consider that to be the case I dont believe that the existence of diverse and disparite opinions necessarily invalidates any of the opinions per se.

    I'm sorry to hear about the lack of critical thinking etc. there's a lot of poor, poor interpretation of the bible in some of the traditions I've discovered are out there, I consider it to be seriously in error, and a lot of it just sets up atheists and atheism as a good idea to casual observers.

  5. #535
    Member DoctorCroupy#9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mole View Post
    I don't describe myself as a secular humanist, rather you have decided yourself to call me a secular humanist.

    I am Western, and the West is based on Ancient Greek philosophy, Judaism, Christianity, and the Enlightenment.

    I do understand though that the words secular humanist are politically loaded terms in the USA. But I don't share USA parochial politics.

    Oh, I just meant that, despite you not calling your beliefs secular humanism, they still very easily fall under that umbrella

    Kind of like how a Protestant might have a preference to be called by the name of a more specific group (like "Baptist" or "Methodist"), despite that group still being a subset of Protestantism.

    What you described would technically make you a secular humanist, despite you not liking that term because of the possible political connotations.

    That's all I meant! I didn't realize you had negative feelings towards the term when I first pointed it out.

  6. #536
    The Memes Justify the End EcK's Avatar
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    none because extraordinary claims require extraordinary proof, and they have none. So Flame worship has as much truth value likelihood as Christianity or the flying spaghetti monster.

    common sense.
    Expression of the post modern paradox : "For the love of god, religions are so full of shit"

    Theory is always superseded by Fact...
    ... In theory.

    “I’d hate to die twice. It’s so boring.”
    Richard Feynman's last recorded words

    "Great is the human who has not lost his childlike heart."
    Mencius (Meng-Tse), 4th century BCE

  7. #537
    The Memes Justify the End EcK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EliaBlack View Post
    I'm an agnostic who was raised Christian. I no longer practice Christianity for the following reasons:

    1. Like most religions, it promotes the concept of women being viewed as possessions rather than people, specifically in marriages. The majority of the bible seems to be written for men. Deuteronomy 5:1 states: "you shall not covet your neighbor's wife." There is no equivalent which states that a woman should not covet another woman's husband. Not to mention the "submit and obey" stuff.

    2. As a kid it was so easy to view Christianity as absolute truth because everyone around me either practiced it or was an atheist. There was no third option, just "believer" and "non-believer." In high school, I learned about other religions that are extremely common in other parts of the world; places in which Christianity has almost no presence at all. In my opinion, this diminishes its credibility. If it hasn't out-survived Shinto and Hinduism, how do we know it's any more true than those?

    3. I remember being annoyed at everyone at youth group because they refused to think for themselves. Specifically, there was one sermon in which the message was basically "lying is always wrong, even if it's to save someone's life." A few people in that group insisted that they would not associate themselves with a person who lied to save their life. I was 14 or 15 at the time, but I still found it ridiculous to view morality as totally objective.

    4. I can recall several instances in which I was saddened and/or outraged by supposedly moral atrocities in the bible, such as a man's entire family (including his children) being killed as a result of his actions, or someone being afflicted with a terrible disease for doing something immoral. Sitting in church, everyone around me seemed to be thinking, "oh yeah, God sure showed them!" but I was just shocked.
    Well
    1st) Whether you agree with something or not should not have any impact on whether it's true or not. So how the bible says women should be treated or what it says about morals is independent from its central claim: that these ideas come from a 'god' who created humanity and the whole universe.
    Expression of the post modern paradox : "For the love of god, religions are so full of shit"

    Theory is always superseded by Fact...
    ... In theory.

    “I’d hate to die twice. It’s so boring.”
    Richard Feynman's last recorded words

    "Great is the human who has not lost his childlike heart."
    Mencius (Meng-Tse), 4th century BCE

  8. #538
    Member DoctorCroupy#9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EcK View Post
    Well
    1st) Whether you agree with something or not should not have any impact on whether it's true or not. So how the bible says women should be treated or what it says about morals is independent from its central claim: that these ideas come from a 'god' who created humanity and the whole universe.
    Well, there actually is no central claim like that in the Bible. The Bible is a collection of writings from multiple authors over a stretch of time that were combined into one book well after they were written, so there is no possible claim in the Bible that fits what all of the writers were collectively expressing.

    The belief that every word came from God (or whatever else has been believed) are actually claims made by the countless faith groups that use the Bible in their worship and beliefs; not the Bible itself.

    My personal belief is that the Bible is the account of people who met God in some way or another. Some of it is allegory, some of it is literal, some of it is embellished and/or hyperbolic because of the writing styles of the times.
    But regardless, any possible inconsistencies in the Bible are the inconsistencies of imperfect humans (who are products of their time periods), who are trying their best to express how God has revealed himself in their lives.

    Of course, those are just my opinions and beliefs (well, aside from the first two paragraphs -- those are pretty factual )
    Likes Ivy liked this post

  9. #539
    The Memes Justify the End EcK's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DoctorCroupy#9 View Post
    Well, there actually is no central claim like that in the Bible. The Bible is a collection of writings from multiple authors over a stretch of time that were combined into one book well after they were written, so there is no possible claim in the Bible that fits what all of the writers were collectively expressing.

    The belief that every word came from God (or whatever else has been believed) are actually claims made by the countless faith groups that use the Bible in their worship and beliefs; not the Bible itself.

    My personal belief is that the Bible is the account of people who met God in some way or another. Some of it is allegory, some of it is literal, some of it is embellished and/or hyperbolic because of the writing styles of the times.
    But regardless, any possible inconsistencies in the Bible are the inconsistencies of imperfect humans (who are products of their time periods), who are trying their best to express how God has revealed himself in their lives.

    Of course, those are just my opinions and beliefs (well, aside from the first two paragraphs -- those are pretty factual )
    Your personal belief is unsubstantiated by fact, so it is in nature no different from someone believing that Sauron is real. How do you reconcile that your faith and belief in the religion you were (most probably) brought up to believe is indeed the right religion out of thousands of other religions with equal truth value (ie: no basis in observable facts for their extraordinary claims) ?
    Expression of the post modern paradox : "For the love of god, religions are so full of shit"

    Theory is always superseded by Fact...
    ... In theory.

    “I’d hate to die twice. It’s so boring.”
    Richard Feynman's last recorded words

    "Great is the human who has not lost his childlike heart."
    Mencius (Meng-Tse), 4th century BCE

  10. #540
    Member DoctorCroupy#9's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EcK View Post
    Your personal belief is unsubstantiated by fact, so it is in nature no different from someone believing that Sauron is real. How do you reconcile that your faith and belief in the religion you were (most probably) brought up to believe is indeed the right religion out of thousands of other religions with equal truth value (ie: no basis in observable facts for their extraordinary claims) ?
    Oh, I know it is unsubstantiated by scientific fact. I'm actually a Catholic convert.

    It's very easy to reconcile it is the right religion when your faith teaches that, while it may be the best representation of God's will on earth, it is not the only representation.

    The Catholic faith does not teach that living on in the afterlife is reserved only for Catholics, or even only for people of Abrahamic faiths. God is taught to be the judge of a person's true intent. Anybody, whether they are Hindu, Atheist, or anything else can be able to live on in 'Heaven' if they are of truly good intent in their souls. The Faith teaches that God is complete mercy. 'Hell' may very well be empty.

    I agree that it could be terribly hard to belong to a religion that wants to say that only they themselves deserve 'Heaven', or whatever they may call it. I chose Catholicism, because if we were to start with the assumption that God can and does exist, the Catholic faith seems to make the most sense to me in answering the age old questions of 'where does life come from?' or 'how did the universe begin?' and 'what happens to others who don't believe the same as I do?' That's, of course, just my opinion. Other's may think other religions make more sense

    But regardless, I don't believe in the existence of God because of science. I have believe in the existence of God through faith, because I am open to the possibility that there are things we cannot discover through natural, physical science.

    (I see you're another ENTP You seem to have taken the more standard ENTP route in your beliefs, or lack thereof. More power to you!)

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