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  1. #41
    Senior Member riva's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    Discussing the definition of words while believing to discuss a complex theoretical question: Ti.

    The alpha male is the alpha male and 'the real alpha male'; otherwise he would not be 'the alpha male'. There are no alpha males in human societies, just men with big egos and small pensis.
    Teehee at Ti.

    Disagreed on the second.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jonny View Post
    Let me preface this by saying that I don't care much about these sorts of definitions; this is a purely intellectual pursuit.

    I'm not sure if your hypothetical alpha male is acting alpha as I understand the term. From the little I've read on the stereotypes, beta males will often attempt to act tough in order to be perceived as tough, but alpha males tend to care less about the perceptions/opinions of others (or won't obsess about them). So, if some guy is trying to act tough, and you ignore or laugh at him, and that makes him mad, then he is, by definition, not an alpha male.
    This.

    Without elaborating much on it, any bully who bullies his into getting what he wants could become a alpha. However if the bully is a bully and if there is anyone with a spine in the group or if the group is mature the bully would lose his alpha status and become openly disgusted or ignored. If the bully os tactful the group has to be mature see through him lest he'd use tact and charm to disarm people's defences.

    I've seen this happen a plenty of times. Bullies fetting away with shit, people eventually waking up or someone with a spine standing up to the bully directly and indirectly.
    .

  2. #42
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    So lets say there is some big shot alpha male acting all big and shit, then there is someone who doesent care about the alpha male trying to be all alpha, but just finds it amusing, laughs at him(understanding it, but not caring if it hits the alpha males ego and makes him angry) and doesent take the alpha male seriously in any way(which will most likely piss off the alpha male and making him try to act bigger, which is just met with more amusement and looking down on the alpha male).
    So which is the real alpha male?
    I don't think you have an accurate understanding of what an alpha male is. an alpha male is someone who is a leader, who has authority and whom people are naturally inclined to follow. you are describing a narcissistic, cock slinging, frat boy-ish douche who wants attention and validation and gets pissed off when people don't kiss his ass (likely an unhealthy 2, 6 or 7).
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  3. #43
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    Discussing the definition of words while believing to discuss a complex theoretical question: Ti.
    ENFP: We put the Fi in Fire
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  4. #44
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    It seems absurd to give this term any significance outside of a structured organization, such as a workplace, which requires a certain degree of authority or supervision. In the social realm, there is no designated hierarchy; it's all subjective. Being loud, obnoxious or trying to dominate other people (however one chooses to define that) doesn't necessarily put them in any sort of leadership position. If simply using any means necessary to satisfy a person's wishes when dealing with others is what constitutes being alpha, then manipulation, passive-aggression and other subtle methods of exerting influence would oftentimes be more effective than overt bullying in this invisible chain of command.

    Look at the prison system. You've got a bunch of men and women who probably view themselves as alphas, but have basically no freedom or power whatsoever. They have a strictly regimented lifestyle which requires them to obey whatever their overlords command them to do, lest they suffer the consequences, including stripping down naked and spreading their ass cheeks for cavity searches. Of course, gangs form in the prison system and there is a constant struggle for dominance among inmates, but as soon as you remove a leader from their sphere of influence, they are no longer alpha. The word only has significance in relation to other people in a specific set of circumstances; any number of variables could put a person in that position or remove them. Being alpha isn't a character or personality trait; it's a temporary status at best. The importance that pop culture puts on men to strive for this status is inane.

  5. #45
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kullervo View Post
    Seriously? All you people think makes someone alpha is how much power they have in society?
    It isn't just their current power, but their potential to have influence in the future, that makes them alpha. It's for this reason that I brought potency/sexual prowess into the picture. If a male can't reproduce then his ability to influence society after his death becomes somewhat more limited. The degree of status he needs to have increases dramatically.
    of course we do, because alpha male is a social dynamic. granted, the motivation for seeking this positional dynamic might be (and often is) sexual in nature, but the dynamic itself serves a social function (particularly if the alpha male is in such a position due to greater experience and/or competence. for those with less experience, skills, etc, taking a back seat and letting someone else call the shots is beneficial to survival)
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  6. #46
    Senior Member INTP's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elfboy View Post
    I don't think you have an accurate understanding of what an alpha male is. an alpha male is someone who is a leader, who has authority and whom people are naturally inclined to follow. you are describing a narcissistic, cock slinging, frat boy-ish douche who wants attention and validation and gets pissed off when people don't kiss his ass (likely an unhealthy 2, 6 or 7).
    I think i can asnwer to you by answering with to this as well:

    Quote Originally Posted by EJCC View Post
    If "the group" is essentially commanded, willingly, by a person, then that person is the alpha. If the group isn't with the person, then (s)he isn't the alpha anymore. Meaning, if one person is unafraid of them and laughs at them, but they are the only one that does so, then they are of no threat to the alpha's status or authority. They're only a threat if people listen to them and start to follow them instead of the alpha.
    Agreed. In the situation i mentioned one is from outside of the alphas tribe and the alpha from one tribe is unable to gain authority over this other person who instead of submitting to alphas authority(what ever the way he gets the authority), just treats the alpha as a fool for even trying. In my eyes by doing this, the person puts the alpha under him. If this would happen inside a group of people and the alpha would be challenged like this, it would naturally be a power battle of the position of the leader.
    Now since the other person in question is outside of the group of alphas authority, the alphas position as the alpha isnt challenged in the group.

    So the question really is on whether someone of another group of people(regardless if he is the alpha of his own group of friends class or whatever or not) is able to make an alpha of another group to be "under him" between the two people. Which one is the bigger "alpha"?
    @Nicodemus there is a reason why i made this topic on philosophy section
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  7. #47
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    @INTP
    fair enough (I agreed with that post as well), but I still disagree with the connotation of your post. you seem to be under the impression that alpha males are really just tribal, chest beating barbarians out for personal glory and masturbating their ego (even if they happen to be wearing suits). imo, it usually plays out in more sophisticated ways (particularly in high society) and isn't necessarily motivated by status, sex or egotism.
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  8. #48
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by INTP View Post
    @Nicodemus there is a reason why i made this topic on philosophy section
    Unfortunately, your implication is quite right. You should aim to imitate the best minds in a given field, though, not the average lecturer.

  9. #49
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    What about mu males?
    [Trump's] rhetoric is not an abuse of power. In the same way that it's also not against the law to do a backflip off of the roof of your house onto your concrete driveway. It's just mind-numbingly stupid and, to say the least, counterproductive. - Bush did 9-11


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  10. #50

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    Quote Originally Posted by msg_v2 View Post
    What about mu males?
    Or Aleph-1? Beyond the Greek system

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