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The Universe

reason

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In 1704 Isaac Newton wrote:

"Is not the Heat of the warm Room convey'd through the Vacuum by the Vibrations of a much subtiler Medium than Air, which after the Air was drawn out remained in the Vacuum? And is not this Medium the same with that Medium by which Light is refracted and reflected, and by whose Vibrations Light communicates Heat to Bodies, and is put into Fits of easy Reflexion and easy Transmission?"​

This medium came to be named aether. The aether theory was thereafter accepted by physicists for almost two centuries, even though many physicists conducted experiments which returned results inconsistent with the theory. That presented a problem, everyone knew that the aether existed, it was in every textbook, how else could electromagnetic waves propogate? The only problem was detecting its presence, and as long as our instruments failed to do this then there was simply something wrong with our instruments.

It wasn't until the famous Michelson-Morley experiment in 1887 that physicists began to seriously look toward alternatives, which conspicuously lacked any need to postulate aether. However, it would still be another couple of decades until the aether would be consigned to the dustbins of scientific history, with others like Lamarckism and vitalism.

The important lesson to learn from this is that nobody ever solved the problem of aether; it would be more appropriate to say that the problem of aether was dissolved, it just disappeared. The problem turned out to be the implicit premise that the aether existed, which arose within the context of Newton's original theory. In the context of rival theories, the problem simply did not arise, and there was no problem to solve.

This example from the history of science is instructive, as it clearly demonstrates how we often become fixed on a problem where no solution is possible. In such a case, we need to analyse our implicit premises. The task is to scrutinise and criticise the context in which our problem arises, what we might call the problem-situation, to see whether or not a problem really exists.

There are a family of closely related cosmological problems I want to breifly consider, examples are:

What is the cause of the universe?
What is the meaning of the universe?
What is beyond the universe?

These problems can be dissolved much like the problem of aether, once it is recognised that the context in which they arise is flawed. The common error is the objectification of the universe, a premise implicit in the question, rendering each question insoluble.

The word universe comes from Latin, and means entire world, all together, turn to one, etc. The prefix uni- means one. However, the context, as presented in these questions is problematic, and to recognise why we'll consider some everyday examples, such as:

What is the cause of that chiming?
What is the meaning of that signpost?
What is beyond my bedroom door?

To the first question, we might answer that a bell is causing the chiming. Though in doing so we presuppose that bells can exist in relation to you, such as that they can cause a chiming sound for you to hear. In other words, we presuppose lawful conditions, in which it is possible for one thing, such as a bell, to have a relationship to you, such that it can cause an effect which you can hear.

To the second question, we might answer that the signpost means that a gas station is 5 miles away. However, in doing so we presuppose that there are particular lawful conditions in which we can stand in relation to the signpost, and using interprative procedures can discern a meaning from it. In fact, should we speak a different language where the same set of symbols on the signpost are interpreted by different rules, we may decide that the signpost means something entirely different.

To the last question, I might conjecture that there is a rodent of unusually large size just beyond my door. Though oncemore, in doing so I presuppose that different objects can exist, have different properties, and stand in relation to each other in a 3-dimensional space. In other words, I presuppose a particular set of lawful conditions in which that is possible.

All these relationships and patterns presuppose laws, the very notion of something having ameaning, a cause or a beyond makes no sense, except where we are talking about objects which obey such laws. In fact, the laws define what an object is, so objects can't exist without laws to define and govern them.

Now, if we consider the universe as an object, which can have a cause, an prior meaning or outside, then we have contradicted our definition of the universe. The universe is by definition everything, including all of the laws which govern it. The moment we begin to ask questions like the above, we implicitly objectify the universe, we treat it as an object which is in turn subject to laws, such as cause and effect or geometrical axioms.

In other words, we have implicitly postulated a metauniverse, which shouldn't exist. Indeed, the problem is unsoluble due to a flawed context, one that unavoidably gives rise to a contradiction. The whole set of problems is dissolved, you might say, by simply adopting a new context free of that contradiction.

Thank you for reading, but that is all... run along!
 

sdalek

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One of the issues I see is that your original questions were universe centric. You have substituted the universe in your questions with non-equal entities. (chiming neq signpost neq bedroom door vs. universe eq universe eq universe) Could this not change the nature of your argument?
 

htb

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Lee, why don't you participate in the confutation of that theory by running through a sprinkler, or joining a book club, or taking up volunteer work, or otherwise satisfying a nervous intellect that -- in fact -- bells do chime, signposts mean what they say, and that rodents of unusual size do not exist.
 

reason

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One of the issues I see is that your original questions were universe centric. You have substituted the universe in your questions with non-equal entities. (chiming neq signpost neq bedroom door vs. universe eq universe eq universe) Could this not change the nature of your argument?
The entities I substituted with 'universe' are equal in the way which was relevant for the argument i.e. they are objects, defined and governed by the laws of the universe.

The point is that when you attempt the same objectification of the universe itself, you become entangled in an unsoluble logical difficulty. In other words, a contradiction.
 

sdalek

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Also, the problem of aether didn't just disappear, it was empirically disproved by the Michelson-Morley experiments which results were verified and validated by repeats of the experiment by other scientists.

Also, how do scientists objectify the universe? It was my understanding that they attempt to qualify and quantify it.
 

Xander

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In other words, I presuppose a particular set of lawful conditions in which that is possible.

All these relationships and patterns presuppose laws, the very notion of something having a meaning, a cause or a beyond makes no sense, except where we are talking about objects which obey such laws. In fact, the laws define what an object is, so objects can't exist without laws to define and govern them.
Well said. The universe is less quantifiable than a human and despite all our attempts at psychological models we fail to encompass the enormity of a singular personality. That problem is exponentially increased relative to complexity and the universe is far more complex than a singular personality (or so we assume :shock: ).

As a side niggle.. definitions cannot exist without laws, it's illogical to say that the object cannot exist without the laws in place to define it as they are placed there by humans to understand the object.
Also, how do scientists objectify the universe? It was my understanding that they attempt to qualify and quantify it.
To try and define something is to objectify it (I believe). Many things are beyond such measures at the moment. We instead work with presumptions and assumptions.
 

sdalek

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To try and define something is to objectify it (I believe). Many things are beyond such measures at the moment. We instead work with presumptions and assumptions.

The definition of "objectify" that I'm familiar with means either to make external or object such as using language to express internal ideas OR to make impersonal or present as an object such as the objectification of women through pornography. I think the definition of "objectify" needs to be clarified so that agreement can be reached on what it is meant.

Also, are we talking purely scientific attempts to define the universe or philosophical discussions seeking to define the universe? While both science and philosophy stem from the same root thought processes, one seeks to explain by a system of physical proof and disproof, the other seeks to explain by discussing the human condition and how the universe relates to it. Or is a different system being referred to?

If you are trying to say that we are operating under a series of theories which must be proven to be fact or disproven so that new theories can be developed, THAT I can agree with.
 

Xander

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The definition of "objectify" that I'm familiar with means either to make external or object such as using language to express internal ideas OR to make impersonal or present as an object such as the objectification of women through pornography. I think the definition of "objectify" needs to be clarified so that agreement can be reached on what it is meant.
Agreed. However to go too far into definitions often ends up in a debate about the word and not the meaning which can become counter-productive.
Also, are we talking purely scientific attempts to define the universe or philosophical discussions seeking to define the universe? While both science and philosophy stem from the same root thought processes, one seeks to explain by a system of physical proof and disproof, the other seeks to explain by discussing the human condition and how the universe relates to it. Or is a different system being referred to?
The interesting thing is that your talking about two systems as one system and then differentiating them based on whether the human mind considers them fact or theory.

"What is now proved was once impossible" William Blake
If you are trying to say that we are operating under a series of theories which must be proven to be fact or disproven so that new theories can be developed, THAT I can agree with.
Nope. We can't prove those theories, we can only prove that one is more likely and hence a better guess.
 

Xander

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Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.1) - Cite This Source
ob·jec·ti·fy /əbˈdʒɛktəˌfaɪ/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[uhb-jek-tuh-fahy] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation
–verb (used with object), -fied, -fy·ing. to present as an object, esp. of sight, touch, or other physical sense; make objective; externalize.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

[Origin: 1830–40; object + -ify]

—Related forms
ob·jec·ti·fi·ca·tion, noun
Dictionary.com Unabridged (v 1.1)
Based on the Random House Unabridged Dictionary, © Random House, Inc. 2006.
American Heritage Dictionary - Cite This Source ob·jec·ti·fy (əb-jěk'tə-fī') Pronunciation Key
tr.v. ob·jec·ti·fied, ob·jec·ti·fy·ing, ob·jec·ti·fies

To present or regard as an object: "Because we have objectified animals, we are able to treat them impersonally" (Barry Lopez).
To make objective, external, or concrete: thoughts objectified in art.

ob·jec'ti·fi·ca'tion (-fĭ-kā'shən) n., ob·jec'ti·fi'er n.

(Download Now or Buy the Book) The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition
Copyright © 2006 by Houghton Mifflin Company.
Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved.
WordNet - Cite This Source objectify

verb
1. make external or objective, or give reality to; "language externalizes our thoughts" [syn: exteriorize]
2. make impersonal or present as an object; "Will computers depersonalize human interactions?"; "Pornography objectifies women" [syn: depersonalize] [ant: gash]

WordNet® 3.0, © 2006 by Princeton University.
 

logan235711

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meta-universe! yes yes! so true : )

"Tell me Sir, what is matter?"




oh, I should say, questions of the form "what is/are" were re-focused to "how it works/behaves" in Joseph Fourier's 1822 mathematical theory of heat : )
 

Siúil a Rúin

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... Now, if we consider the universe as an object, which can have a cause, an prior meaning or outside, then we have contradicted our definition of the universe. The universe is by definition everything, including all of the laws which govern it. The moment we begin to ask questions like the above, we implicitly objectify the universe, we treat it as an object which is in turn subject to laws, such as cause and effect or geometrical axioms.

In other words, we have implicitly postulated a metauniverse, which shouldn't exist. Indeed, the problem is unsoluble due to a flawed context, one that unavoidably gives rise to a contradiction. The whole set of problems is dissolved, you might say, by simply adopting a new context free of that contradiction.
When people say 'universe' many times they are referring to the observable universe, 3-D space that moves through time and can be traced back to the Big Bang, etc. The questions you mention in your post relate, in my mind, to the question of whether what we comprehend as the 'universe' is the sum total of it, or if our observable 'universe' is a component of something larger. Math operates in higher dimensions and there are other theories suggesting the universe is larger than what we have observed.

Every other life-form is aware of only a fragment of what we know to be the universe. Why would humans be any different, only able to perceive a fragment of what is? There are likely questions we 'can't' answer, or more to the point, questions we cannot think to ask. For an ant, the earth as an object does not exist. For a cat the solar system does not exist in its 'universe', and so forth. What doesn't 'exist' for humans? I realize it is speculation, but the ability to speculate could have value to foster growth?

I can see that speculation taken too far is meaningless, but humans can glimpse just enough beyond what we know to inspire a continual search. Our perception of the 'universe' has broadened so drastically in the development of science that I can see some drive to continue to withhold conclusions about the sum total of it.
 

hereandnow

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When people say 'universe' many times they are referring to the observable universe, 3-D space that moves through time and can be traced back to the Big Bang, etc. The questions you mention in your post relate, in my mind, to the question of whether what we comprehend as the 'universe' is the sum total of it, or if our observable 'universe' is a component of something larger. Math operates in higher dimensions and there are other theories suggesting the universe is larger than what we have observed.

Every other life-form is aware of only a fragment of what we know to be the universe. Why would humans be any different, only able to perceive a fragment of what is? There are likely questions we 'can't' answer, or more to the point, questions we cannot think to ask. For an ant, the earth as an object does not exist. For a cat the solar system does not exist in its 'universe', and so forth. What doesn't 'exist' for humans? I realize it is speculation, but the ability to speculate could have value to foster growth?

I can see that speculation taken too far is meaningless, but humans can glimpse just enough beyond what we know to inspire a continual search. Our perception of the 'universe' has broadened so drastically in the development of science that I can see some drive to continue to withhold conclusions about the sum total of it.

Why say universe? Is the plural not possible?
 

reason

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When people say 'universe' many times they are referring to the observable universe, 3-D space that moves through time and can be traced back to the Big Bang, etc. The questions you mention in your post relate, in my mind, to the question of whether what we comprehend as the 'universe' is the sum total of it, or if our observable 'universe' is a component of something larger. Math operates in higher dimensions and there are other theories suggesting the universe is larger than what we have observed.

Every other life-form is aware of only a fragment of what we know to be the universe. Why would humans be any different, only able to perceive a fragment of what is? There are likely questions we 'can't' answer, or more to the point, questions we cannot think to ask. For an ant, the earth as an object does not exist. For a cat the solar system does not exist in its 'universe', and so forth. What doesn't 'exist' for humans? I realize it is speculation, but the ability to speculate could have value to foster growth?

I can see that speculation taken too far is meaningless, but humans can glimpse just enough beyond what we know to inspire a continual search. Our perception of the 'universe' has broadened so drastically in the development of science that I can see some drive to continue to withhold conclusions about the sum total of it.
nocturne said:
The word universe comes from Latin, and means entire world, all together, turn to one, etc. The prefix uni- means one... Now, if we consider the universe as an object, which can have a cause, a prior meaning or outside, then we have contradicted our definition of the universe. The universe is by definition everything, including all of the laws which govern it.

I don't care to argue the meaning of words. Of course, if you redefine 'universe,' then it can be used in the plural and such concepts as a metauniverse may be consistent; but then if you redefine 'pig,' then I might consistently talk of a jet powered supersonic pig.

The 'universe' is defined as totality of everything, and you can't have an everything + 1.
 

reason

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Also, the problem of aether didn't just disappear, it was empirically disproved by the Michelson-Morley experiments which results were verified and validated by repeats of the experiment by other scientists.
The problem of aether did disappear. I rarely invoke Kuhn in talks concerning metascience i.e. the philosophy of science, but here I'll make an exception, since his theory of paradigmatic science is very close to my concept of theoretical context.

The problem of aether arose in the Newtonian paradigm, where physicists felt some medium was necessary to carry electromagnetic waves, and experiments which returned results inconsistent with the aether theory were problematic. The prevailing paradigm implied that the aether existed, so the problem was to reconcile the experimental results with the existence of aether.

The problem of aether disappeared, not because it was solved, but because it was dissolved as what we might call a psuedoproblem. In other words, a seemingly intractable problem with no solution, arising from inconsistent or false premises. In Kuhnian language, a paradigm shift, or scientific revolution occured, in which the whole Newtonian paradigm was replaced, and within the context of this new paradigm the problem of aether did not arise.

Also, how do scientists objectify the universe? It was my understanding that they attempt to qualify and quantify it.
I didn't mention scientists specifically. In fact, theologians are more likely candidates for this error.
 
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