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  1. #21
    Away with the fairies Southern Kross's Avatar
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    I agree that there's this whole atheist discourse out there that's condescending and obnoxious, especially on the internet - and I say this as an atheist (albeit an agnostic atheist).

    I think there's little point arguing over the existence of god; people either believe or they don't. Some will try to rationalise their belief or lack thereof, but IMO this is merely an argument developed after the fact to justify their pre-existing, instinctive conclusion. Turning it into a debate over who is more rational is entirely missing the point; you might even say it's irrational.

    I don't like anyone cramming their belief system down other people's throats and treating non-believers like inferior beings. And yes, atheism is also a belief system until the existence of god can be disproven beyond all doubt, which I can't see happening any time soon.

    A lot of atheists out there need to STFU; sometimes I'm embarrassed to call myself one.
    INFP 4w5 so/sp

    I've dreamt in my life dreams that have stayed with me ever after, and changed my ideas;
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    - Emily Bronte

  2. #22
    A Gentle Whisper ~MS*ANGEL~'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by superunknown View Post
    I converted my agnostic friend into an atheist last night.

    Took about two sentences.
    Huh now I'm curious to know what exactly you said.
    Only she who attempts the absurd can achieve the impossible... and then some.

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  3. #23
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Southern Kross View Post
    And yes, atheism is also a belief system until the existence of god can be disproven beyond all doubt, which I can't see happening any time soon.
    Is a lack of belief in ghosts also a belief system?

  4. #24
    Senior Member TreeBob's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Southern Kross View Post
    I agree that there's this whole atheist discourse out there that's condescending and obnoxious, especially on the internet - and I say this as an atheist (albeit an agnostic atheist).

    I think there's little point arguing over the existence of god; people either believe or they don't. Some will try to rationalise their belief or lack thereof, but IMO this is merely an argument developed after the fact to justify their pre-existing, instinctive conclusion. Turning it into a debate over who is more rational is entirely missing the point; you might even say it's irrational.

    I don't like anyone cramming their belief system down other people's throats and treating non-believers like inferior beings. And yes, atheism is also a belief system until the existence of god can be disproven beyond all doubt, which I can't see happening any time soon.

    A lot of atheists out there need to STFU; sometimes I'm embarrassed to call myself one.
    I think your points above are valid, but if someone is fully atheist then they do not hold a belief system. I don't believe there is no god, there is no god. You may call it semantics, but I don't think about god or any other spiritual what ifs. I don't care to convert anyone to my line of thinking because it isn't a belief system to convert someone to. I suppose maybe there are some weird atheists who think of it like Buddhism as a way of life?

    I BELIEVE that anyone who tries to shove religion or atheism down someone throat is a troll. I'm rambling...
    Don't like my modera... Oh wait, wrong forum. Carry on.

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  5. #25
    Parody Parrot meowington's Avatar
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    my 2 cents : I dislike militant atheïsm almost as much as militant religion.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Morning Star View Post
    Huh now I'm curious to know what exactly you said.
    Even if a supremely powerful being were to interject his existence, he would become a facet of that existence.

    I owe a particular allegiance to nothing, and that is what agnosticism purportedly bulwarks against - the potential to recognize this figure in the universe. Atheism does not preclude the existence of this godly being, it precludes that this being's potential in the universe is of moral significance, that sovereignty is kept through revelations made. It is a philosophy that remains neutral to all forces playing the universe, while agnosticism remains in appeal.

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by miauwington View Post
    my 2 cents : I dislike militant atheïsm almost as much as militant religion.
    Why almost?

  8. #28
    A Gentle Whisper ~MS*ANGEL~'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by superunknown View Post
    Even if a supremely powerful being were to interject his existence, he would become a facet of that existence.

    I owe a particular allegiance to nothing, and that is what agnosticism purportedly bulwarks against - the potential to recognize this figure in the universe. Atheism does not preclude the existence of this godly being, it precludes that this being's potential in the universe is of moral significance, that sovereignty is kept through revelations made. It is a philosophy that remains neutral to all forces playing the universe, while agnosticism remains in appeal.
    Ah, I see - thanks!
    Only she who attempts the absurd can achieve the impossible... and then some.

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  9. #29
    Parody Parrot meowington's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by DiscoBiscuit View Post
    Why almost?
    because militant religion just tends to be even more in your face / obnoxious than militant atheism.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by miauwington View Post
    because militant religion just tends to be even more in your face / obnoxious than militant atheism.
    I'm of the opinion that its the person that determines the obnoxiousness not the ideology.

    Assuming otherwise seems like a subtle attempt to malign one ideology, or more accurately those who subscribe to it.

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