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Thread: The GOD Thread~

  1. #51
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    My Goddess treats me like a cute dog, and I make Her smile as She sings and I dance with a big evil grin!

  2. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nights and Days View Post
    I think the proof of God's existence lies within the self, and It's not something that I, nor anyone can prove to you with any evidence that you would accept. You need to look for yourself.
    We are inter-subjective animals, so evidence is what we can share with each other.

    A fantasy, an imagining, an hallucination, that can't be shared with others is not evidence.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Zangetshumody View Post
    A real Christian is a real messenger of Glad tidings.
    This is the No true Scotsman Fallacy. It is a well known logical fallacy.

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by inventor View Post
    I never claimed to be a Christian, what I'm saying is you have billions of people all on this planet saying they are Christian with all very differ views on what a Christian is. I've read the bible cover to cover, and have studied it for over 10 years, and you can look at one verse, and easily get a thousands ideas on what it means - all non conclusive. So when someone talks about true Christians, and fake Christians I scuff at the idea.
    I don't think you understand what a Christian is.

    A Christian professes the Nicene Creed and belongs to a Church.

    The New Age for instance doesn't profess the Nicene Creed and is not a Church.

    Some belong to a Church that doesn't profess the Nicene Creed and so are not a Christian Church, such as the Mormons.

  5. #55
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mole View Post
    We are inter-subjective animals, so evidence is what we can share with each other.

    A fantasy, an imagining, an hallucination, that can't be shared with others is not evidence.
    but what about the spirit? fantasy, imagining, and hallucinations are products of the mind. they exist on the carnal level of the human mind.

    spiritual experiences come from a different place entirely. they exist on the spiritual plane which transcends humanity.
    You hem me in -- behind and before;
    you have laid your hand upon me.
    Such knowledge is too wonderful for me,
    too lofty for me to attain.

  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by AphroditeGoneAwry View Post
    I know what you mean. I was only a little girl, attending church when the Abraham/Isaac story was read. I thought how can God demand a man kill his own son??? On top of that, all the animal sacrifices didn't go down well with the young animal activist that I was. It literally made me veer from God, and pushed me along the path toward atheism.

    But the Bible must be read in order, from beginning to end. Because that is the best way to hear a story, and to read a story, to understand it. We need the context of the OT before we can truly place the NT in its proper place.
    Let's look at the context.

    God ordered Abraham to tie up his son and stand over him in preparation to cut Isaac up alive. This is simply child abuse.

    This, as you say, is part of a story. And it is the story of the Abrahamic religions. And Isaac is a precursor to Jesus. And so God tied His Son, Jesus, to the Cross and tortured Him to death. And this is also child abuse.

    And today in the Royal Commission into Child Abuse in Australia we hear of child abuse perpetrated by the Roman Catholic Church, the Anglican Church, the Salvation Army and even the YMCA (Young Men's Christian Association).

    Christianity began in child abuse and continued in child abuse for almost 2,000 years until we brought them to account in Ireland in 2009 and now in Austalia in 2014.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mole View Post
    This is the No true Scotsman Fallacy. It is a well known logical fallacy.
    This is true, but your definition also suffers from the same logical fallacy. Every Christian denomination has dogma that is divergent from the others, yet you have specifically identified the Trinity as an essential Christian doctrine. When some denominations believe in the doctrine of the Trinity and others do not, where is the authority - the vetting panel if you will - that declares the Trinity essential? There isn't one. It's impossible to be an apostate to Christianity, only to a specific denomination. You've simply made the assertion as if it were fact and trusted that the force of your certainty would put an end to the issue.

    To me, any denomination that has as its central tenet salvation based on Jesus' death and resurrection is Christian. That's why it's called Christianity. The rest is window dressing. I'm sure most Christian denominations would disagree with that simple a definition, but that's because they have their own dogmas. Hence some evangelicals saying that Catholics aren't "real" Christians and several denominations saying Mormons aren't "real" Christians. They can hardly be expected to view the matter objectively. But we should.
    Everybody have fun tonight. Everybody Wang Chung tonight.

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    Quote Originally Posted by five sounds View Post
    but what about the spirit? fantasy, imagining, and hallucinations are products of the mind. they exist on the carnal level of the human mind.

    spiritual experiences come from a different place entirely. they exist on the spiritual plane which transcends humanity.
    There is no evidence whatsoever for the exitence of supernatural beings such as Zeus or Poseidon or the Trinity.

    And spiritual experiences are entirely human. They are experienced by humans and they have human meanings.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Mole View Post
    There is no evidence whatsoever for the exitence of supernatural beings such as Zeus or Poseidon or the Trinity.

    And spiritual experiences are entirely human. They are experienced by humans and they have human meanings.
    it's different. you'll see.
    You hem me in -- behind and before;
    you have laid your hand upon me.
    Such knowledge is too wonderful for me,
    too lofty for me to attain.

  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by EffEmDoubleyou View Post
    This is true, but your definition also suffers from the same logical fallacy. Every Christian denomination has dogma that is divergent from the others, yet you have specifically identified the Trinity as an essential Christian doctrine. When some denominations believe in the doctrine of the Trinity and others do not, where is the authority - the vetting panel if you will - that declares the Trinity essential? There isn't one. It's impossible to be an apostate to Christianity, only to a specific denomination. You've simply made the assertion as if it were fact and trusted that the force of your certainty would put an end to the issue.

    To me, any denomination that has as its central tenet salvation based on Jesus' death and resurrection is Christian. That's why it's called Christianity. The rest is window dressing. I'm sure most Christian denominations would disagree with that simple a definition, but that's because they have their own dogmas. Hence some evangelicals saying that Catholics aren't "real" Christians and several denominations saying Mormons aren't "real" Christians. They can hardly be expected to view the matter objectively. But we should.
    I just can't agree with you.

    To be a Christian without the Trinity is being a Christian when we are not having any Christianity.

    The Trinity is a central doctrine of Christianity. And those who deny the Trinity, deny Christianity.

    I do understand the soft focus New Age wants to have their cake and eat it too.

    The New Age wants Jesus without Christianity.

    But His very name is Jesus Christ, Jesus the Christ.

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