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  1. #61
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    You are trying and failing to throw your weight around. As usual.

  2. #62
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    I ain't throwing anything sparky.

    I'm just calling you on your bullshit.

  3. #63
    Senior Member zago's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salomé View Post
    There is nothing charming about this book. Any non-sociopath should be able to see that.


    Hardly. You talk about rationality, but your approach is that of disciple or cult-follower. A truly rational person would examine each rule individually, the pros and cons, how strong is Greene's case and what are the moral implications. Still better, examine the original texts yourself, without Greene's cynical "spin".

    This is what genuine rationality, coupled with genuine morality, and in my view, genuine success, looks like:

    Again, I think something about this topic is upsetting you.. frankly it is absurd and downright paranoid to say anyone who enjoyed this book is either a sociopath or a "wannabe-sociopath." Cool down, and stop trying to make everything so dramatic! I got up this morning, texted some friends, petted my bunny, and cleaned. I'm not some monster here. I'm just a guy like anyone else trying to be more effective in how I interact with the world, and I'm trying to have a constructive discussion that everyone can learn from. Nothing more.

    That said, I did watch your video, and I thought it was fine. I agreed with what he was saying, but it is hardly anything new. Also, he is more describing a way to view the world than any actual strategy for success. That's like... square zero. Once you make the statement: "yes, I will make the most of myself as I can, but I will remember to see the best in people no matter what their success looks like," the question is then, "how do I move on to the next step and start being successful?" Getting stuck at the philosophy from that video would be like sitting by a pool rambling on and on about your opinions and judgments about swimming but never actually jumping in. And I'm sure de Botton has more specific knowledge about how to communicate and get his way in the world, but that's simply not what his talk was about. He did get the talk, didn't he? That definitely required some people handling. Like a lot of it.

    So... what's the hang up? The danger with this kind of talk is that inevitably people will interpret in it that they don't have to try to be successful, that no one should ever get to judge them, etc. I would love for that to be the case, but believe me, I'm not waiting for folks to come around on this one. If you want the job you want, the friends you want, the girl you want, you better have something to show for yourself. You've got to try to give people a reason to admire you. I'm not the type (anymore) to sit around in my own mess all day and wonder why no one's noticing me even though I'm such a good person in my opinion and never really did anything wrong.

    Results matter. Yes, life is mean like that. Go ahead. Sit around, talk about why everyone is so evil in this world. Preach about how they should change. See where it gets you. Me? I'm not waiting for the world to suddenly turn into a nice place so I can be loved for my good intentions. I'm going to learn how to empower myself and better influence people, and that's going to involve taking action and winning them over. I'm not going to sit in my dark little corner and snipe at them. That doesn't work. If it's what you want, congratulations. I hope you love your ivory tower.

  4. #64
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by zago View Post
    Again, I think something about this topic is upsetting you.. frankly it is absurd and downright paranoid to say anyone who enjoyed this book is either a sociopath or a "wannabe-sociopath." Cool down, and stop trying to make everything so dramatic!
    I'm frosty, ta. I'm just disagreeing with your evangelism. Don't take it so personally. This book won't help you with your poor social skills. End of.

    My point with the video is that you're falling into the trap of allowing someone else to define your ideas about success. They are shallow and meaningless.

  5. #65
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    This might be inflammatory, but whenever I look at the philosophy sub-forum and which people are responsible for so much of the threads, I understand why philosophy gets a bad rap.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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    Live and let live will just amount to might makes right

  6. #66
    Senior Member zago's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salomé View Post
    you're falling into the trap of allowing someone else to define your ideas about success. They are shallow and meaningless.
    Sorry but you can't say that, however much you'd love to. You've never met me. My ideas of success are having good relationships (family, friends, love), building on my talents and making something of myself, enjoying life, and building my wealth and influence so I can make the world beautiful and better. I've seen improvement in all of these areas since I defined them as goals, and it's really making me happy. If your deep and meaningful goals don't resemble my shallow, meaningless ones, I would absolutely LOVE to hear about them.

  7. #67
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    Just referring to what you said here:
    Quote Originally Posted by zago View Post
    I think success and mastery are very well defined, fairly universal concepts, personally.
    I agree, as does de Botton. Many people get it wrong in the same way and make themselves miserable.
    As such, the problem is "universal".

    If you want to make this book your bible, no one will stop you, but if you think you're going to find converts around here, you're mistaken.

  8. #68
    Senior Member zago's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salomé View Post
    Just referring to what you said here:

    I agree, as does de Botton. Many people get it wrong in the same way and make themselves miserable.
    As such, the problem is "universal".

    If you want to make this book your bible, no one will stop you, but if you think you're going to find converts around here, you're mistaken.
    Bible? Evangelism? Converts? ... It's just a discussion about stuff in a book. Like I've said, I think it is clear that we see these laws a lot in life, and this is 1 thread on this whole forum in which I would like to talk about it.

    One minor problem I had with his talk was that he seems to forget that the "fun is in the hunt." If you think you know what success is but you are wrong, you still gained a lot of wisdom and experience in searching for it and finding out that wasn't it. And you also know a little bit more about yourself and what you want. That's life, and it's everyone's goal to get a little closer all the time to what works for them. We can't sit around wondering too much about what "our own version" of success is. If you see something you want, go for it, even if it is what everyone wants. Some things are just good.

  9. #69
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    Whatever. I wish you luck in your quest. Don't say you weren't warned.

  10. #70
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    AffirmitiveAnxiety's guide to Life is like a Jar of Silverskin onions

    There are many people in todays world who struggle with coming to terms with their weaknesses and desires. Such people try to force their way or use cheap, tacky online lists that claim to help them improve their social skills, careers, relationships and so on.

    However these are all false, they try to abuse and manipulate poorly and pathetically those around them, which is exactly what the Silverskin onion rules do not do!

    So do you wish to learn and know how you can enjoy them and life, by seeing the inner onion in everyone and harness it's power to your success?

    If so...READ ON:

    1) Always twist....never pull.

    It may seem that getting what you want can be achieved with tenacity and hard work, but this is untrue. Like a jar of silverskin onions life becomes easier once one works out that you need to twist the lid...rather than pulling forcefully upon it. When this is done people will be amazed at your subtle aura of power, they will gasp in amazement. "How did this person achieve what no one else could? The removing of a silverskin onion jar lid?" Because you thought of it and no one else did, they will see you as a leader, confident and proud. This will boost your self esteem, without resulting to group backstabbings or social powerplays.

    2) Lick the vinegar off

    Like Silverskin onions, people surround themselves with a bitter shield of briny frustrations. The best way to bypass these defences and gain access to that persons emotions and fears is to lick them with your tongue. Once the aura is worn away by your self-assured licking, the person will be laid bare to you and they are now yours to influence with your new found confidence from rule 1.

    3) Crunch the layers, don't pick

    Like the best military tactics, shock and awe is your friend here. Once you have removed the barriers identified in rule 2, a person is naked to your brilliant flame of influence. Like a silverskin onion, people have these complex interwoven drives and desires that they try to mask under multiple layers. The best way to get to that soft, white....creamy centre, is to crunch right down on the outer skins of the individual.

    Bite hard and fast, don't pick them slowly, or else the vinegar aura from rule 2) will have time to reform and then you will be surrounded by the floating skin of the persons layers.

    4)Gulp don't chew.

    Once rule 3 has been achieved, the person is now yours. Nothing stands between you and them, they are putty in your sticky, onioney, hands.

    Except for one last step.

    So now you must devour that last centre part, or else the sour taste of the vinegar that has been surrounding the person and trapped in by the layers will stick in your throat and cause your eyes to water, undoing all the good work of rules 1, 2 and 3.

    So gulp this last part down and now the person is your pawn. You have finally achieved success with others and through them you now have the power to reach your goals.


    So remember the 4 rules:

    1) Always twist....never pull.

    2) Lick the vinegar off

    3) Crunch the layers, don't pick

    4) Gulp don't chew.

    Try them out on the next person you see in the street.

    By following these simple, but effective, guidelines the key to happiness, wealth, jail and happiness is yours for the taking.

    If you don't believe me, just look at how successful I am:



    As you can see, there are no onions in my jar!
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

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