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  1. #31
    reflecting pool Typh0n's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by superunknown View Post


    The core of it really overrides libertarian presuppositions, that a democracy is a collective establishment of law and regulations.
    I never defined democracy that way, nor did I define it all for the sake of this thread yet. The meaning of democracy is basically, the rule of the people("demos" = people "cracy" = reign). I define democracy as a system where the people rule(or at least are made to feel like they do, which would be pseudo-demoracy rather than real democracy). I think a rule of the people is ulitimately a problem because most people dont really know whats best; some do, sure, and its not necessarily the rich and the few who deserve any kind of say in matters of politics, but, staying on topic, I dont feel that rule of the people is good in most countries.You have to understand that here in Beglium, its not a tradition for people to question where their tax dollars are going, or what the governement is doing, like it is in America. In France, I hear its a bit different, but still, they almost had Marine LePen be elected president of the Republic, so I dunno.

    But theres worse. White supremacist parties are gaining a foothold all over Eastern Europe, Russia, Ireland... to the point that in Hungary the Neo Nazi party has a significant foothold in the governemnt. It wasnt enough for us Europeans, that we had Hitler, Stalin, and Mussolini now many want a return to the proleteriat style nationalism of the Nazis. People never learn, which is why they shouldnt be allowed to govern. The same is true in America, I think, but so far America has avoided dictators so I say they have better handled their responsibilty in that regard(no offense to my fellow Europeans).

  2. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salomé View Post
    So move to America, where idiocy is appreciated.
    If America is idiotic for not tolerating extremist parties where does that leave Europe?

  3. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmail! View Post
    What I mean is that in France, somebody who would openly display a French flag in front of his house would be considered a dangerous would-be fascist/extremist/lunatic, a threat to the neighbourhood. Now, imagine our reaction when we discover the streets of your suburbs...

    And I guess it's the same in most Western Europe, with the notable exception of Norway. But precisely, Norwegian blind nationalism is considered scary by most foreign European visitors. It is something the vast majority of us does not understand.
    Because of Norway's sordid history of Imperialism?

  4. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Typh0n View Post
    If America is idiotic for not tolerating extremist parties where does that leave Europe?
    Your argument is a mess. (If it's not just a troll.)

  5. #35
    reflecting pool Typh0n's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    I dont believe so.
    So, then, which one do you believe, too much freedom or no freedom?



    Socialism I dont think is about whether people can work or not or the availability of health services, I dont believe that at all, those are questions of efficiency, equity, public ethics even but not socialism.
    Concurred.

    I think socialism has to do with the importance of social struggles and class struggles for public life and the economy.
    Isnt class struggle more a Marxist idea?

  6. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salomé View Post
    Your argument is a mess. (If it's not just a troll.)
    You trolled first.

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Typh0n View Post
    You trolled first.
    Hardly. I didn't write that clusterfuck of an OP. But thanks for the confirmation.

  8. #38
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    Quote Originally Posted by Salomé View Post
    Hardly. I didn't write that clusterfuck of an OP. But thanks for the confirmation.
    What do you want from me?

  9. #39
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    Think before you post. Identify the core of the problem. Construct consistent arguments.

  10. #40

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    Quote Originally Posted by Typh0n View Post
    So, then, which one do you believe, too much freedom or no freedom?





    Concurred.



    Isnt class struggle more a Marxist idea?
    I dont believe there's such thing as too much freedom, class struggle predates and postdates marx completely, it first appears in Aristotle when he takes about the different artisan classes and interest groups trying to influence politics to their favour.

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