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  1. #1
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Equality, Deference and Dominance

    Should I treat you as an equal?

    The immediate answer is yes.

    But for 200,000 years we lived with deference and dominance. It was only in the European Enlightenment of the 17th and 18th centuries that we started to see ourselves as equals.

    And so today when I don't treat you as an equal, your ego objects, because your ego has introjected the recent values of the Enlightenment of freedom and equality. Why, even the President is only the First Among Equals.

    But things are changing.

    For 200,000 years deference and dominance were a necessary part of the roles we played in society.

    And as we look around us on Central, we find all of us are playing roles. We have an avatar with a role playing name.

    On Central, the first thing we do give up our individual identity based on equality, and adopt a role, dare I say, based on deference and dominance.

    But I would be pretty daring to say who should defer to who, but this is because we are in a stage of transition, and before long we will be demanding deference and dominance. We will have a moral crusade for deference and dominance. And before long we will take deference and dominance for granted. And once again deference and dominance will be the natural order.

  2. #2
    Senior Member Little_Sticks's Avatar
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    Let God's word be known! Victor judges all as one!


  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Little_Sticks View Post
    Let God's word be known! Victor judges all as one!

    Yes, as we move from literate individualism to electric tribalism, we feel all as one.

    This is the work we are doing here. We are learning to synchronise our feelings across the world, just as a traditional tribe synchronise their feelings across the village.

    The traditional tribe could synchronise their feelings across a village, because everyone in the village was in shouting distance, and feelings become contagious, and all feel as one.

    In the same way the electric tribe can synchonise our feelings across the world because everyone in the global village is within spontaneous emotion contact, and we are all starting to feel as one.

    Of course it is taking a while to get our head around this.

  4. #4
    darkened dreams labyrinthine's Avatar
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    My ideal is also equality and symmetry in relationships. I can be convinced of the utility of the other dynamics if it is more efficient when applied in a specific context. If someone has greater or lesser knowledge than myself, I hope to acknowledge that honestly and benefit from whichever dynamic results in the most gain of skill or knowledge. I also could be convinced of deferring to someone else if it meant I didn't have to be responsible for something I am not skilled at or in which I am not interested.
    Step into my metaphysical room of mirrors.
    Fear of reality creates myopic morality
    So I guess it means there is trouble until the robins come
    (from Blue Velvet)

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    Should I treat you as an equal?

    The immediate answer is yes.

    But for 200,000 years we lived with deference and dominance. It was only in the European Enlightenment of the 17th and 18th centuries that we started to see ourselves as equals.

    And so today when I don't treat you as an equal, your ego objects, because your ego has introjected the recent values of the Enlightenment of freedom and equality. Why, even the President is only the First Among Equals.

    But things are changing.

    For 200,000 years deference and dominance were a necessary part of the roles we played in society.

    And as we look around us on Central, we find all of us are playing roles. We have an avatar with a role playing name.

    On Central, the first thing we do give up our individual identity based on equality, and adopt a role, dare I say, based on deference and dominance.

    But I would be pretty daring to say who should defer to who, but this is because we are in a stage of transition, and before long we will be demanding deference and dominance. We will have a moral crusade for deference and dominance. And before long we will take deference and dominance for granted. And once again deference and dominance will be the natural order.
    Objectively speaking, human beings are all equally unimportant in the grand scheme of things, so in this respect Equality is the correct attitude. The only reason why some people (eg Albert Einstein) are held as more important than others (eg Paris Hilton) is because we, as human beings, tend to believe some achievements/people are more "worthy" than others. But these are just emotional evaluations.

    If this is about group dynamics, then there have always been leaders and followers. It's the quickest, most efficient way of getting things done.

  6. #6
    Filthy Apes! Kalach's Avatar
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    So, "we" means white people?


    *skywhale*
    Bellison uncorked a flood of horrible profanity, which, translated, meant, "This is extremely unusual."

    Boy meets Grr

  7. #7
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by En Gallop View Post
    Objectively speaking, human beings are all equally unimportant in the grand scheme of things, so in this respect Equality is the correct attitude. The only reason why some people (eg Albert Einstein) are held as more important than others (eg Paris Hilton) is because we, as human beings, tend to believe some achievements/people are more "worthy" than others. But these are just emotional evaluations.

    If this is about group dynamics, then there have always been leaders and followers. It's the quickest, most efficient way of getting things done.
    In a society based on roles, the protocol of deference and dominence allows one role to relate to another role.

    Of course this is foreign to us today as we live in a world of freedom and equality.

  8. #8
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kalach View Post
    So, "we" means white people?
    *skywhale*
    The 'we' is the etribal 'we'. It is not the royal 'we, nor is it the white 'we'.

    So the etribal 'we' is the 'we' of the global village, and includes anyone in reach of the electronic media, and that means almost everyone alive today.

  9. #9
    Filthy Apes! Kalach's Avatar
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    Sounds like a yes.

    By far the largest group in this global non-village is Asian. They didn't have the Enlightenment and they don't use English. They barely if ever communicate with we, and we wouldn't know they were there if we didn't go looking. In fact, by language the internet is currently only about a quarter English-speaking. And that percentage is shrinking.

    http://www.internetworldstats.com/stats.htm
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Global_Internet_usage

    85% of Africans, 70% of Asians, and 60% of the Middle east are not yet online. The majority of North Americans and Australians are. You're already outnumbered and it's only going to get... better.
    Bellison uncorked a flood of horrible profanity, which, translated, meant, "This is extremely unusual."

    Boy meets Grr

  10. #10
    reflecting pool Typh0n's Avatar
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    ITT about equality I see not a valid logical arguement for the basis of equality.

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