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  1. #41
    LL P. Stewie Beorn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mane View Post
    hmm, the only encounter i remember that implies that description is jacob wrestling the angel & grabbing onto it's heel as it tries to fly away.



    in other cases it's all sort left for the imagination, though in eiyov it's implied that they are at least somewhat human - i mean, they can fit comfortable in his house, take a sit, wine & dine... i'd imagine if they came as giant twirling eyeball wheels that wouldn't be as easy.




    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ophanim



    (FYI, no i don't believe in angels, but too much coding taxed my Ti filter, and in what's left is the Ne world where everything is possible).
    I'm not sure why angels are always portrayed as having wings. No actual angels are ever described as having wings (at least in my Protestant version of the bible). Only the ornamental cherubims on the Ark had wings.
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  2. #42
    Senior Member cafe's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mane View Post
    hmm, the only encounter i remember that implies that description is jacob wrestling the angel & grabbing onto it's heel as it tries to fly away.



    in other cases it's all sort left for the imagination, though in eiyov it's implied that they are at least somewhat human - i mean, they can fit comfortable in his house, take a sit, wine & dine... i'd imagine if they came as giant twirling eyeball wheels that wouldn't be as easy.




    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ophanim



    (FYI, no i don't believe in angels, but too much coding taxed my Ti filter, and in what's left is the Ne world where everything is possible).
    I'm going to try to pull up what I can from Sunday school, etc. I only know the Protestant Cannon and my religion does not put much emphasis on teaching about angels, so this is all I've got:

    Satan was a very beautiful angel called Lucifer that was involved in music or praise when he rebelled against God along with a third of the angels. They got kicked out of heaven and are now demons. Or that's how my church teaches it.

    There was angel with a flaming sword posted to keep people out of the Garden of Eden after Adam and Eve got kicked out.

    Sons of God, which may have been some kind of angels, hooked up with human women and their children were giants. They were supposed to have been killed in the flood, but giants are talked about later on, like when David killed Goliath. If those were angels, they almost had to be some kind of humanoid.

    Abraham had at least one encounter with angels and they looked like men. That was when he was trying to talk them out of destroying Sodom and Gomorrah. I can't remember if it was a separate incident when he told him that Sarai/Sarah would have a son.

    The incident you described was with Jacob/Israel.

    The angel of death that struck the firstborn of Egypt isn't described.

    At least one angel appeared to Gideon when there was conflict with Midian.

    Horses and chariots of fire showed up when Israel was at war in Elisha's time.

    An angel appeared in the furnace Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego got thrown into for not worshiping a golden idol in Babylon.

    I think one appeared to Daniel in the book of Daniel when he was praying that God would let the Jews free from captivity in Babylon so they could go back to Judea. I can't remember if he looked like something other than a man. And I'm not sure if that was when he was having a dream or a vision or if it was just normal like talking to anybody.

    I think Ezekiel saw some of the weirder looking heavenly beings in visions, but I'm not real strong on any of the prophetic books, so I'm not certain about that.

    An angel appeared to Zechariah, John the Baptists's dad. I think that angel was scary if not shiny.

    One appeared to Mary before she conceived Jesus. He was apparently scary. Then twice to Joseph in dreams -- once to tell him Mary wasn't messing around on him and another to tell him to flee to Egypt before the Slaughter of the Innocents. And angels appeared to shepherds when Jesus was born. They were shiny and scary. And, I think, to the Magi in a dream to tell them to not tell Herod where they found baby Jesus.

    Angels took care of Jesus after his temptation in the desert, but they aren't described.

    Then there are a lot of crazy things happening in the book of Revelations some of which involve angels.

    I'm sure I missed quite a few instances, but my brain thinks I should sleep soon and isn't cooperating anymore.
    “There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old’s life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.”
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  3. #43
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    Default Angels and Demons

    Trust me, as I cross my heart and hope to die, just as I believe in the nine levels of angels, I believe in all the demons. Here they are, meet them-

    Aamon or Amon (Christian demonology)
    Abaddon/Apollyon (Christian demonology)
    Abalam (Christian demonology)
    Abezethibou (Testament of Solomon)
    Abraxas (Gnosticism)
    Abyzou (Jewish mythology)
    Adramelech (Assyrian mythology, Christian demonology)
    Aeshma (Zoroastrianism)
    Agaliarept (Jewish mythology)
    Agrat Bat Mahlat (Jewish demonology)
    Agares (Christian demonology)
    Agiel (Jewish mythology)
    Ahriman/Angra Mainyu (Zoroastrianism)
    Aim/Haborym (Christian demonology)
    Aka Manah/Akem Manah/Akoman/Akvan (Zoroastrianism)
    Ala (Slavic mythology)
    Alal (Chaldean mythology)
    Alastor (Christian demonology)
    Alloces/Allocer (Christian demonology)
    Allu (Akkadian mythology)
    Amaymon (Christian demonology)
    Amdusias (Christian demonology)
    Ammut (Egyptian mythology)
    Amon (Christian demonology)
    Amy (Christian demonology)
    Anamalech (Assyrian mythology)
    Andhaka (Hindu mythology)
    Andras (Christian demonology)
    Andrealphus (Christian demonology)
    Andromalius (Christian demonology)
    Antichrist (Christian demonology)
    Anzu (Sumerian mythology)
    Apep (a.k.a. Apophis) (Egyptian mythology)
    Armaros (Jewish demonology)
    Archon (Gnosticism)
    Asag (Sumerian demonology)
    Asakku (Babylonian mythology)
    Asb'el (Jewish mythology)
    Asmodai/Asmodeus (Jewish folklore and Christian mythology)
    Astaroth (Christian demonology)
    Asura (Hindu mythology)
    Azazel / Azaz'el (Jewish demonology)
    Azi Dahaka/Dahak (Zoroastrianism)
    B [edit]Baal/Bael (Christian demonology)
    Balam (Christian demonology)
    Balberith (Jewish demonology)
    Bali Raj (Hindu mythology)
    Banshee (Irish mythology)
    Baphomet (Christian folklore)
    Barbas (Christian demonology)
    Barbatos (Christian demonology)
    Bathin/Mathim/Bathym/Marthim (Christian demonology)
    Beball (Christian demonology)
    Beelzebub (Jewish demonology, Christian demonology)
    Behemoth (Jewish demonology)
    Belial (Jewish demonology, Christian demonology)
    Beleth (Christian demonology)
    Belphegor (Christian demonology)
    Berith/Beherit (Phoenician mythology, Christian demonology)
    Bhūta (Sanskrit)
    Bies (Slavic mythology)
    Bifrons (Christian demonology)
    Boruta (Slavic mythology)
    Botis (Christian demonology)
    Buer (Christian demonology)
    Bukavac (Slavic mythology)
    Bune (Christian mythology)
    Bushyasta (Zoroastrianism)
    C [edit]Caim/Camio (Christian demonology)
    Carabia (Christian demonology)
    Charun (Etruscan mythology)
    Chemosh (Moabite mythology)
    Choronzon (Thelema)
    Cimejes/Kimaris/Cimeies (Christian demonology)
    Corson (Christian demonology)
    Crocell/Procell (Christian demonology)
    Culsu (Etruscan mythology)
    D [edit]Daeva (Zoroastrianism demonology)
    Dagon (Semitic mythology)
    Dajjal (Islamic demonology)
    Dantalion (Christian demonology)
    Danjal (Jewish mythology)
    Dasa (Hindu mythology)
    Davy Jones (nautical folklore)
    Decarabia (Christian demonology)
    Demiurge (Gnosticism)
    Demogorgon (Christian demonology)
    Devil (Christian demonology)
    Div-e Sepid (Persian mythology)
    Drekavac (Slavic mythology)
    Dzoavits (Native American mythology)
    E [edit]Eligos (Christian demonology)
    Eisheth (Jewish demonology)
    Empusa (Greek mythology)
    Euryale (Greek mythology)
    Eurynomos (Greek mythology)
    Eblis (Islamic demonology)
    F [edit]Familiars (Christian demonology)
    Focalor (Christian demonology)
    Foras/Forcas/Forras/ (Christian demonology)
    Forneus (Christian demonology)
    Furcas/Forcas (Christian demonology)
    Furfur (Christian demonology)
    G [edit]Gaap (Christian demonology)
    Gader'el (Jewish demonology)
    Gaki (Japanese mythology)
    Gamigin (Christian demonology)
    Gello (Greek mythology, Christian mythology)
    Ghoul (Arabian and several other mythologies)
    Glasya-Labolas/Caacrinolaas/Caassimolar/Classyalabolas/Glassia-labolis (Christian demonology)
    Gorgon (Greek mythology)
    Gremory/Gomory (Christian demonology)
    Grigori (Jewish demonology)
    Gualichu (Mapuche mythology)
    Guayota (Guanche mythology)
    Gusion/Gusoin/Gusoyn (Christian demonology)
    H [edit]Haagenti (Christian demonology)
    Halphas/Malthus (Christian demonology)
    Harpy (Greek mythology)
    Haures/Flauros/Flavros/Hauras/Havres (Christian demonology)
    Humbaba (Sumerian mythology, Akkadian mythology)
    I [edit]Ifrit (Islamic mythology)
    Incubus (Christian demonology, Chaldean mythology, Jewish folklore)
    Ipos/Ipes (Christian demonology)
    Iblis (Islamic demonology)(Satan)
    J [edit]Jinn (Islamic demonology)
    Jikininki (Japanese mythology)
    K [edit]Kabandha/Kabhanda (Hinduism)
    Kasadya (Jewish demonology)
    Kokb'ael (Jewish demonology)
    Kali (Hindu mythology)
    Kroni (Ayyavazhi demonology)
    Krampus (Germanic-Christian Demonology)
    L [edit]Labal (Christian demonology)
    Lady Midday (Slavic mythology)
    Lamashtu (Sumerian mythology)
    Lamia (Bulgarian folklore, Christian demonology and Greek mythology)
    Latiangle (Christian demonology)
    Legion (Christian demonology)
    Lechies (Slavic mythology)
    Leyak (Indonesian mythology)
    Lempo (Finnish mythology)
    Leraje/Leraie (Christian demonology)
    Leviathan (Jewish demonology, Christian demonology)
    Lili/Lilin/Lilim (Jewish demonology)
    Lilith (Sumerian mythology, Akkadian mythology, Jewish folklore)
    Lucifer (Christian demonology)
    Lucifuge Rofocale (Christian demonology)
    M [edit]Malphas (Christian demonology)
    Mammon (Christian demonology)
    Mara (Buddhist mythology)
    Maricha(Hindu mythology)
    Marax/Morax/Foraii (Christian demonology)
    Marbas (Christian demonology)
    Marchosias (Christian demonology)
    Masih ad-Dajjal/Ad-Dajjal/Dajjal (Islamic eschatology)
    Mastema (Jewish demonology)
    Medusa (Greek mythology)
    Mephistopheles (Christian folklore, German folklore)
    Merihem (Christian demonology)
    Moloch (Christian demonology)
    Murmur (Christian demonology)
    N [edit]Naamah (demon) (Jewish demonology)
    Naberius/Cerbere (Christian demonology)
    Naberus (Christian demonology)
    Naphula (Christian demonology)
    Ninurta (Sumerian mythology, Akkadian mythology)
    Namtar (Sumerian mythology
    O [edit]Onoskelis (Testament of Solomon)
    Oray (Christian demonology)
    Orcus (Roman mythology, later Christian demonology)
    Orias (Christian demonology)
    Oriax (Christian demonology)
    Ornias (Testament of Solomon)
    Orobas (Christian demonology)
    Orobos (Christian demonology)
    Ose (Christian demonology)
    Ördög (Hungarian mythology)
    P [edit]Paimon (Christian demonology)
    Paimonia (Christian demonology)
    Paymon (Christian demonology)
    Pazuzu (Akkadian mythology, Sumerian mythology)
    Phenex (Christian demonology)
    Penemue (Jewish and Christian demonology)
    Pithius (Christian demonology)
    Pruflas (Christian demonology)
    Pruslas (Christian demonology)
    Puloman (Hindu demonology)
    Purson/Curson (Christian demonology)
    Q [edit]R [edit]Rahab (Jewish folklore)
    Raim (Christian demonology)
    Raum (Christian demonology)
    Ronove (Christian demonology)
    Ronwe (Christian demonology)
    Rusalka (Slavic mythology)
    Rakshasa (Hinduism)
    Rangda (Hinduism)
    Ravan (Hinduism)
    S [edit]Sabnock (Christian demonology)
    Saleos (Christian demonology)
    Samael (Jewish demonology)
    Satan (or Shaytan) (Jewish demonology, Christian demonology, Islamic demonology)
    Salpsan[1]
    Scox (Christian demonology)
    Seir (Christian demonology)
    Semyaz (Jewish demonology)
    Shax/Chax (Christian demonology)
    Shedim (Jewish folklore)
    Sitri (Christian demonology)
    Sthenno (Greek mythology)
    Stolas/Solas (Christian demonology)
    Succubus (Sumerian mythology, Akkadian mythology, Jewish folklore, Christian demonology)
    Surgat (Christian demonology)
    T [edit]Tannin (Jewish demonology)
    U [edit]Ukobach (Christian demonology)
    Uvall (Christian demonology)
    V [edit]Valac (Christian demonology)
    Valefar/Malaphar/Malephar (Christian demonology)
    Vapula (Christian demonology)
    Vassago (Christian demonology)
    Vepar (Christian demonology)
    Vephar (Christian demonology)
    Vine (Christian demonology)
    W [edit]X [edit]Xaphan (Christian demonology)
    Xezbeth (demonology)[clarification needed]
    Y [edit]Yeqon
    Yeter'el
    Z [edit]Zagan (Christian demonology)
    Zepar (Christian demonology)
    Ziminiar (Christian demonology)

    And don't forget that every ideology has a demonology.

  4. #44
    Gotta catch you all! Blackmail!'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    And don't forget that every ideology has a demonology.
    You forgot this one:

    Carl Jung (Freudian mythology)
    "A man who only drinks water has a secret to hide from his fellow-men" -Baudelaire

    7w8 SCUxI

  5. #45
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    The Unconverted

    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmail! View Post
    You forgot this one:

    Carl Jung (Freudian mythology)
    It's true, Carl Jung is a demon in my ideology. And I try and I try to convert everyone to my ideology, but I am preaching to the unconverted.

  6. #46
    LL P. Stewie Beorn's Avatar
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    Take the weakest thing in you
    And then beat the bastards with it
    And always hold on when you get love
    So you can let go when you give it

  7. #47
    Gotta catch you all! Blackmail!'s Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    It's true, Carl Jung is a demon in my ideology. And I try and I try to convert everyone to my ideology, but I am preaching to the unconverted.
    And don't forget Plato's daemon too (δαίμων)...

    "'What would Eros then be?' I said. 'A mortal?'
    "'Hardly that.'
    "'Well, what then?'
    "'Just as before,' she said, 'between mortal and immortal.'
    "'What is that, Diotima?'
    "'A great daemon, Socrates, for everything daemonic is
    between god and mortal.'
    "'With what kind of power?' I said.
    "'Interpreting and ferrying to gods things from human beings
    and to human beings things from gods: the requests and sacri-
    fices of human beings, the orders and exchanges-for-sacrifices of
    gods; for it is in the middle of both and fills up the interval so
    that the whole itself has been bound together by it. Through this
    proceeds all divination and the art of the priests who deal with
    sacrifices, initiatory rituals, incantations, and every kind of sooth-
    saying and magic. A god does not mingle with a human being;
    but through this occurs the whole intercourse and conversation of
    gods with human beings while they are awake and asleep. And
    he who is wise in things like this is a daemonic man; but he who
    is wise in anything else concerning either arts or handicrafts is
    vulgar and low. These daemons are many and of all kinds; and
    one of them is Eros.'


    (Symposium -265)
    "A man who only drinks water has a secret to hide from his fellow-men" -Baudelaire

    7w8 SCUxI

  8. #48
    Theta Male Julius_Van_Der_Beak's Avatar
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    Angels having wings is probably something that was borrowed from Zoroastrian (Persian) iconography.



    I like the weird eye-wheel things better. Much better than creepy harp-playing babies. I heard somewhere that all the baby angels are supposed to be unbaptized babies that have to serve God in penance for not being baptised. Does anyone know what I'm talking about? I think it's a Catholic thing.
    [Trump's] rhetoric is not an abuse of power. In the same way that it's also not against the law to do a backflip off of the roof of your house onto your concrete driveway. It's just mind-numbingly stupid and, to say the least, counterproductive. - Bush did 9-11


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  9. #49
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by msg_v2 View Post
    I heard somewhere that all the baby angels are supposed to be unbaptized babies that have to serve God in penance for not being baptised. Does anyone know what I'm talking about? I think it's a Catholic thing.
    Yeah, it's called Limbo. It's where unbaptised babies go. But get this! After centuries of Limbo, a few years ago the Vatican abolished Limbo!

    And what I want to know is, what happened to all the babies?

  10. #50
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blackmail! View Post
    Lol I've always seen Jesus as more of a vampire than a zombie, because of superstrength to move the boulder, the fact he can fly, and that he still had most of his mental faculties after death. Also, there was a period where he was really "dead" before he reanimated, which is far from rare in vampire lore.

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