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  1. #1
    Junior Member Idealistforthefuture's Avatar
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    Default Question for other INFJs

    I have a question to pose to other philosopher INFJ's, as due to out MBTI we are the type most likely to be idealists. And I've noticed that with my own philosophical views. So I'd find it interesting to hear other INFJ's opinions on their favorite philosophers. My own being Plato and Karl Marx and would love to have a discussion on the matters of idealistic philosophers. This is mainly due to the fact anyone else I've talked with about philosophy has had a very different MBTI then myself and while appreciate arguments with them I can also find it a bit irritating for no one to ever be able to see things through the idealist point of view.

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    Senior Member cafe's Avatar
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    I'm an idealist, but I don't read much non-fiction. Sorry.
    “There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old’s life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.”
    ~ John Rogers

  3. #3
    Sniffles
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    How is idealism defined here? In typological terms or metaphysical? In terms of metaphysics I'm more a realist actually.

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    Senior Member the state i am in's Avatar
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    haha yeah, marx is the opposite of idealist, philosophically speaking. turning hegel on his head.

    J types can be idealist in general because they rely on abstract categories to mediate the world in almost every single thought process; they work with the representation as it can be communicated rather than the phenomenological experience more directly. universals vs particulars, etc.

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    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peguy View Post
    How is idealism defined here? In typological terms or metaphysical? In terms of metaphysics I'm more a realist actually.
    I was thinking that myself actually, if you're an idealist wouldnt you be more of a Hegelian than interested in Marx or Plato, they're both materialists right?

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    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by the state i am in View Post
    haha yeah, marx is the opposite of idealist, philosophically speaking. turning hegel on his head.

    J types can be idealist in general because they rely on abstract categories to mediate the world in almost every single thought process; they work with the representation as it can be communicated rather than the phenomenological experience more directly. universals vs particulars, etc.
    This interests me a lot, this final line, I knew that about Marx but say more about this final line, I've been trying to read more on phenomenology lately as its one of the big undiscovered countries philosophically which I've less knowledge of.

    I've been reading someone called Husserl, or something like that, and another guy called Mercel Mont Perly or something. They're all continental theoriests arent they? So far it seems overly complex, like a reinventing of the wheel.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    I was thinking that myself actually, if you're an idealist wouldnt you be more of a Hegelian than interested in Marx or Plato, they're both materialists right?
    Hegelians are one kind of Idealists, Kantians and Berkley are other kinds. Marx was a materialist but Plato definitely wasn't. You maybe thinking of Epicurus.

    I will admit a certain attraction to Idealists and certain themes of Idealism, but in the end I think it has too many flaws. Realism seems more up my alley, with perhaps some Idealists elements thrown in.

    This interests me a lot, this final line, I knew that about Marx but say more about this final line, I've been trying to read more on phenomenology lately as its one of the big undiscovered countries philosophically which I've less knowledge of.

    I've been reading someone called Husserl, or something like that, and another guy called Mercel Mont Perly or something. They're all continental theoriests arent they? So far it seems overly complex, like a reinventing of the wheel.
    Yes Husserl is generally considered the father of Phenomenology. Related to this discussion, Husserl seems to have been more realist in his early days but later on became more idealist in inclination. So a huge dispute among phenomenologists is between those favoring realism and those favoring idealism.

    Max Scheler was another major phenomenologist who might interest you.

  8. #8
    Senior Member the state i am in's Avatar
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    bracketing is another term for extroverted perception not mediated by meaning. merleau-ponty, i think, has his own category for this. i remember we read phenomenology of perception preface two or three times in undergrad.

  9. #9
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    Quote Originally Posted by Idealistforthefuture View Post
    I have a question to pose to other philosopher INFJ's, as due to out MBTI we are the type most likely to be idealists. And I've noticed that with my own philosophical views. So I'd find it interesting to hear other INFJ's opinions on their favorite philosophers. My own being Plato and Karl Marx and would love to have a discussion on the matters of idealistic philosophers. This is mainly due to the fact anyone else I've talked with about philosophy has had a very different MBTI then myself and while appreciate arguments with them I can also find it a bit irritating for no one to ever be able to see things through the idealist point of view.

    Plato and Marx huh? Unusual combination. Why those two? I have trouble finding similarities between the two, on the contrary I see a lot of differences, also Marx is not an idealist, the Marxist theory is defined as dialectical materialism. Personally I have a taste for the existential and aesthetic questions mostly and I wouldn't say I have favorite philosophers, I like certain ideas from certain philosophers. Hooray for eclecticism.

  10. #10
    reflecting pool Typh0n's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    I was thinking that myself actually, if you're an idealist wouldnt you be more of a Hegelian than interested in Marx or Plato, they're both materialists right?
    Plato is actually the "father" of idealism in the western philosophical tradition lol. Marx, though, was a materialist yes.


    Anyways to answer the OP, I would differeciate between the idealist temperament and idealistic philosophy, the former may actually idealize a materialistic conception of the universe. Personally, I am an idealist in philosophy though. .
    Last edited by Typh0n; 05-14-2013 at 03:09 PM.

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