Optimism and pessimism

[miss fortune]

Those pesky nuns. Tsk tsk. Reading books by those puppy eating yellow people.

USA USA USA USA!!

but... but... she was nice, and helped poor people and had a really good education and is friends with my grandma!

of course I wasn't in the US, which might have something to do with all of the commie literature

 

[Mole]

I first read the I Ching when a nun gave me a copy of it while I was spending the summer in a convent

There are very few nuns left in the convent today, but I notice they are interested in mbti.

So I am not surprised the nuns were interested in the I Ching, because both the I Ching and mbti are superstitions, not based on evidence or reason.

 

[miss fortune]

There are very few nuns left in the convent today, but I notice they are interested in mbti.

So I am not surprised the nuns were interested in the I Ching, because both the I Ching and mbti are superstitions, not based on evidence or reason.

never heard mention of the MBTI while there, and for the amount of good that they did who cares?

I'm talking about the book, not the divination technique, if you're getting the two confused...

 

[SolitaryWalker]

Tradition, authority and faith are unreasonable?

That wasn't the implication of my claim. It is possible to use reason to arrive at the same conclusion as those provided by tradition, authority and faith. However, to use reason means to think in an autonomous fashion: a person whose worldview is guided by tradition or authority only accepts the conclusions that were offered to him or her.

never heard mention of the MBTI while there, and for the amount of good that they did who cares?

I'm talking about the book, not the divination technique, if you're getting the two confused...

Boy, I just can't wait for some folk-typologist to start whizzing poetically about how the "philosophies" of some types are more optimistic than that of others or about how some types are inherently Western or Eastern.

 

[miss fortune]

Boy, I just can't wait for some folk-typologist to start whizzing poetically about how the "philosophies" of some types are more optimistic than that of others or about how some types are inherently Western or Eastern.

it could be worse... they could (and probably will) assign them MBTI types

 

[RaptorWizard]

Pessimism is a form of optimism because it challenges things in an attempt to cause change.

 

[KDude]

Pessimism is a form of optimism because it challenges things in an attempt to cause change.

Not necessarily. Example: When I was a kid, me and a friend used to line up trashcans and leap over them (we were bored). A new kid came by and wanted to try. I was "pessimistic". I didn't really want "change" though. I wanted to see him hit the ground face first - which is exactly what happened.

Point being.. sometimes pessimism is merely to point out the ensuing train wreck.

 

[miss fortune]

... and sometimes pessimism is just hopeless

 

[SolitaryWalker]

it could be worse... they could (and probably will) assign them MBTI types

Ok, who here wants to argue that an ISTJ is a pessimistic type? There's something about your ISTJ uncle that's dour and glum, so there we go, there is something about ISTJs that's inherently pessimistic.

 

[miss fortune]

Ok, who here wants to argue that an ISTJ is a pessimistic type? There's something about your ISTJ uncle that's dour and glum, so there we go, there is something about ISTJs that's inherently pessimistic.

I dunno... the one at the other end of the couch seems pretty optimistic about the idea that he'll have time for both me AND WOW... and I'm feeling pessimistically like I'm going to be a WOW widow... but then again, that's anecdotal evidence that can't stand up to the TRUTH of a valid and scientific system!

 

[Mole]

The Good Folk

Boy, I just can't wait for some folk-typologist to start whizzing poetically about how the "philosophies" of some types are more optimistic than that of others or about how some types are inherently Western or Eastern.

The good folk tell me that some of us are SolitaryWalkerish and some of us are Victorish.

 

[Thalassa]

Interestingly, China has a better word for John chapter 1's use of the "Word" (greek "logos"). In Chinese translations, John is translated "In the beginning was the Tao.." (this isn't some new fad based translation btw). Tao captures a lot of the spirit of John's meaning of logos. "Word" was a carryover from Jerome's Latin translation "Verbum". It doesn't convey it appropriately. Logos was a living, all embodying force. Like Tao. There was power in "speech" under this view, but it goes beyond just "the Word".

Anyways, just thought I'd chime in. It's kind of neat that a Chinese translation is more accurate, in this case.

I agree, agree so much! The Bible actually made a lot more sense to me after I began studying Taoism, I realized the broad concepts it was teaching that are so "literalized" in many protestant churches in the U.S.

I've also stumbled across some interesting interpretations of Christianity, and I've read the bloggings of a Muslim woman from a country where there isn't a lot of cultural violent sexism or terrorism explain the fundamentals of the way she interprets Islam, and suddenly something clicked for me, and I was really able to see how similar most Eastern thought is, although the Abrahamic faiths (Christianity, Judaism, Islam) are less preferred by me, I prefer Taoism and Zen Buddhism, but Christianity in a broad interpretation holds interest for me because of the culture in which I was raised and currently live.

 

[Thalassa]

It has nothing to do with grammar. Learn to read Koine and get back to me...

KDude is right, he's looking at it from an Ni perspective, I think, where he's looking at the underlying meaning...and the underlying meaning of Word is the essential intention of energy that brings all things into being, the formless thing which gives thing form: another term for the formless thing which gives things form is Tao.