User Tag List

First 1234 Last

Results 11 to 20 of 117

  1. #11
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    1,392

    Default

    Being rational has as little to do with it as being ruled non-rational motives. Actually they are one and the same. It's more of an issue of the force of ones will to overturn implemented structures of ideas, as well as the thought of rationale leading you towards the realization that we're an irrelevant flame burning in the nothingness of space. Sometimes it's rational to put aside that rationality in order to gain some form of peace, that's what I've gained from conversations with a few theists. I still find it craven, even though completely understandable.

  2. #12
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    MBTI
    xxTP
    Posts
    1,260

    Default

    @greenfairy - no, it isn't discounted. I explained why in that same post you quoted. HE would be creator of the universe and not exist 'within' it.

    Just ask yourself, we apply normal laws of science to our daily experience in this universe, and they work. But they contradict themselves when they try to explain existence itslef.

    2 different levels of philosophy.

  3. #13
    insert random title here Randomnity's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    MBTI
    ISTP
    Enneagram
    6w5 sp/sx
    Posts
    9,489

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    This is a psychological motivation, which though probably correct, is not a logical justification for the argument for a God like thing's existence.
    How is it not logical? Unexplained phenomenon --> search for explanation --> "god", or science (or a hybrid, I suppose). Fairies don't have a similar pathway, so it makes sense that fewer people would think that they exist. Motivation IS justification, when it comes to religious (etc) beliefs....

    I mean, it's not logical in the sense that you can form a mathematical proof, but that applies equally to all supernatural beliefs (god, fairies, flying spaghetti monster, etc), pretty much by definition. None of them are "logical", or scientific.
    -end of thread-

  4. #14
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    MBTI
    iNfj
    Enneagram
    6w5 sx/sp
    Posts
    4,042

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Randomnity View Post
    I mean, it's not logical in the sense that you can form a mathematical proof, but that applies equally to all supernatural beliefs (god, fairies, flying spaghetti monster, etc), pretty much by definition. None of them are "logical", or scientific.
    Exactly my point. You can't very well argue that God's existence is more rationally justified than fairies.
    Quote Originally Posted by Il Morto Che Parla View Post
    @greenfairy - no, it isn't discounted. I explained why in that same post you quoted. HE would be creator of the universe and not exist 'within' it.

    Just ask yourself, we apply normal laws of science to our daily experience in this universe, and they work. But they contradict themselves when they try to explain existence itslef.
    So if God created nature then God is separate from nature, i.e. super-natural. Unless god and nature are the same thing. In which case you're a pagan. So if one supernatural thing exists, there's no reason another couldn't exist, except that you're just assuming that God created fairies, which not everyone believes.
    Quote Originally Posted by Il Morto Che Parla View Post
    2 different levels of philosophy.
    Maybe, if so I haven't gotten there yet. Please elaborate on which school/level of philosophy this is based on.
    Quote Originally Posted by Within View Post
    Being rational has as little to do with it as being ruled non-rational motives. Actually they are one and the same. It's more of an issue of the force of ones will to overturn implemented structures of ideas, as well as the thought of rationale leading you towards the realization that we're an irrelevant flame burning in the nothingness of space. Sometimes it's rational to put aside that rationality in order to gain some form of peace, that's what I've gained from conversations with a few theists. I still find it craven, even though completely understandable.
    True. So essentially what people have been saying is that belief in God is not based in reason, and it is justified because 1) people have a use for it and 2) it gives them peace. Well, I could say the same about fairies, and those same people would assert that my belief should be based in reason (which it actually is), making them intellectual hypocrites.

  5. #15
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Enneagram
    5w6 sp/sx
    Posts
    17,581

    Default

    God's existence may not be more objectively supported than that of fairies, but rationality is not the same thing. The statement "It is irrational to describe Cinderella as a spoiled brat." makes perfect sense though it pertains to an imaginary (fictional) person, because even the fantastic can be held to a certain internal consistency.

    So, to answer the OP: every person has beliefs about topics and questions that go beyond what can be objectively studied. These beliefs are necessarily subjective, informed by the person's values, understanding, and life experiences. For some people, the subjective world view formed in this way is consistent with the existence of fairies; for others it is not.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  6. #16
    Banned
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Posts
    1,392

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    making them intellectual hypocrites.
    I wouldn't say so, but that doesn't mean that I disagree. It's a softer world indeed.

  7. #17
    Senior Member
    Join Date
    Oct 2012
    MBTI
    xxTP
    Posts
    1,260

    Default

    @greenfairy

    No. Like I said, we apply within the universe, the laws of science which we know to govern it internally.

    However these laws by definition cannot explain the existence itself of the universe, as shown by quantum physics.

    I hope you are making a point for atheism rather than actually arguing the existence of fairies, lol.

  8. #18
    LL P. Stewie Beorn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Posts
    4,805

    Default

    I don't believe in them (or at least ponder their existence very often) for the same reason that atheists don't (or shouldn't) believe in them; they do not fit within my comprehensive worldview. It has nothing to do with proving or not proving their existence.
    Take the weakest thing in you
    And then beat the bastards with it
    And always hold on when you get love
    So you can let go when you give it

  9. #19
    Nips away your dignity Fluffywolf's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2009
    MBTI
    INTP
    Enneagram
    9 sp/sx
    Posts
    9,422

    Default

    Belief is not about proving points or being right or wrong.

    That is why belief is not for me, because I am a major bigot. But I urge others not to be a bigot and also believe in something. The two really don't mix. Leave the bigotry to apatheists like me! :>
    ~Self-depricating Megalomaniacal Superwolf

  10. #20
    Sniffles
    Guest

    Default

    Nevermind.
    Last edited by Sniffles; 01-17-2013 at 02:42 PM. Reason: I should know better.

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 1
    Last Post: 08-31-2014, 09:45 AM
  2. [MBTItm] How can I tell if I'm and INFP or ISFP?
    By ItsAlwaysSunny in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: 06-08-2011, 03:45 PM
  3. How can you distinguish between Ne-Fi and Fi-Ne?
    By FalseHeartDothKnow in forum Myers-Briggs and Jungian Cognitive Functions
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: 04-16-2010, 09:47 AM
  4. The joy of being unreachable and not connected
    By UnitOfPopulation in forum The Bonfire
    Replies: 16
    Last Post: 11-14-2009, 05:56 PM
  5. How can a young person become a hero/ine?
    By coberst in forum Philosophy and Spirituality
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: 10-30-2009, 10:36 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO