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  1. #11
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by whatever View Post
    nothing I don't use in the kitchen... though if someone presses me I have some pretty vicious knives in the kitchen!

    and now for a quote from molly ivins that pretty much sums up my thoughts on things

    I am not anti-gun. I'm pro-knife. Consider the merits of the knife. In the first place, you have to catch up with someone in order to stab him. A general substitution of knives for guns would promote physical fitness. We'd turn into a whole nation of great runners. Plus, knives don't ricochet. And people are seldom killed while cleaning their knives.
    I'd love to have the skill in throwing knives or using other throwing weapons which I've seen in some movies or at some stage events.

  2. #12
    Temporal Mechanic. Lexicon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tyrinth View Post
    Ah, okay. It's just that my view isn't black or white. Much like a pollutant is a resource out of place, I view weapons as tools turned against a living creature. I was just curious about your perspective, and why you said that.
    My swiss army knife has been quite useful over the years with random repairs or assisting others with such things, when I'm away from home. [screwdriver, scissors, etc.] I even used it as one of the tools I needed to break into my own car when I locked myself out, before.

    I don't go hunting, though I've gutted a fish with the hunting knife when camping, in the past. I consider that more along the lines of "food preparation," not stabbing a living thing, as.. it was definitely dead before I did that. But I see your point. Perhaps my fishing pole was the deadly weapon in that scenario.

    I tend to associate the term 'weapon,' as an object to use to defend oneself from harm, but most things we use to prep food can most certainly be used to kill someone, as well. Hell, even a chair leg can be a deadly weapon. Or a fist.
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  3. #13
    ... Tyrinth's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post

    My friend that I mentioned who was worried about dying unarmed could be arrested and charged for having a simple pocket knife, now, I dont know how frequently that happens or what discretion a police officer has in that but I was told by a police officer once that they could arrest and charge anyone for "going prepared" or having offensive weapons if they had grounds to believe something would be used as a weapon, ie as much as a pen could qualify.
    I know there are culture differences and all, but honestly, I think that's going too far, and is a major reason I will always defend gun rights despite not being a gun owner myself. People have a right to defend themselves, and as soon as a government starts to consider something like a pen a weapon, I think something has gone horribly wrong.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    ... they are also generally made and serve one purpose, harming or killing, however legitimate a purpose that may serve it is still an ugly thing to contemplate.
    I hear this often, but I generally have difficulty agreeing with this stance unless they can prove that something literally has no purpose but to harm or kill. People claim firearms are designed to do nothing but harm or kill. I may be delusional or something, but I view the purpose of a firearm as being to throw a metal projectile downrange at high speeds. There are plenty of people who enjoy just going to ranges to shoot firearms, and have no intention of ever turning them on a person. I think that people are taking away too much of the human element when they blame so much on the tool.

    Knives are the same way. Their purpose is to cut things; they are a tool. If you use them on a person, that's your problem, not the knife's.

    Actually, if you want to argue about something only being a weapon, I think that things like tasers and stun-guns deserve more flak than just about anything else. I have difficulty coming up with anything that you could do with them besides turn them on a person...

    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    ... or love possessions more than they can or would people. Now that's not restricted to weapons by any stretch, some people love cards or collecting things more than they would persons but I often think of it with respect to weapons because of a lot of the legendary weapons or fighters myths I know associated with Irish, Norse and Scandinavian sagas and stories.
    I understand this, in fact, I've shown shades of it myself, unfortunately.
    ...

  4. #14
    Mojibake sprinkles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    I'd love to have the skill in throwing knives or using other throwing weapons which I've seen in some movies or at some stage events.
    It's fun to throw knives and watch them stick but really isn't practical. Unless you're just doing this as a hobby.

    Knife is better off staying in your hand if you can help it. If you miss, you just gave your attacker a weapon.

    Throwing a shovel or axe in desperation might be different as they are pretty intimidating. Someone might be able to deflect a thrown knife but nobody in their right mind will stand in the way of a thrown axe.

  5. #15
    LL P. Stewie Beorn's Avatar
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    Right now by the bed I just have a big heavy maglite flashlight that doubles as a club.

    At some point in the future I'd like to have a Taurus Judge that that shoots both shotgun shells and .45 colt ammo.



    I'm just interested in home defense and would never want a conceal and carry permit, although I might hang out with one of these:

    Take the weakest thing in you
    And then beat the bastards with it
    And always hold on when you get love
    So you can let go when you give it

  6. #16
    Senior Member Pseudo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    Well just the same sorts of reflections as I posted about myself, weapons, owning weapons, possessing them, whether or not you would use them for their intended purposes, whether you're under any obligation or feel any obligation goes with ownership.

    In the example of sikhism I believe there are writings of gurus which suggest that believers and practitioners of that faith should possess and carry a number of items to assist them with fufilling their duties, only one of which is the dagger but the dagger is one of them, whether they are ceremonial or not its one of the basis for circumventing the UK's pretty strict possession of weapons laws.

    My friend that I mentioned who was worried about dying unarmed could be arrested and charged for having a simple pocket knife, now, I dont know how frequently that happens or what discretion a police officer has in that but I was told by a police officer once that they could arrest and charge anyone for "going prepared" or having offensive weapons if they had grounds to believe something would be used as a weapon, ie as much as a pen could qualify.

    Although I dont know off hand what obligations go with the possession of the dagger for a sikh, I know that they were once a core troop of forces allied or serving in the british empire and probably at a time when side arms were there for the purpose of being used in immanent battle.

    I feel conflicted about weapons, I them as ornate things, I also like and appreciate their proper purpose too and there is the whole "its merely a tool" school of thought aswell but they are also generally made and serve one purpose, harming or killing, however legitimate a purpose that may serve it is still an ugly thing to contemplate. I remember reading that some asian temples equiped their monks with weapons which were in the order of maces, staffs, flails because being blunt instruments they did not necessarily mean the drawing of blood, probably a tenuous idea given that blunt trauma is just as serious and frequently involves the drawing of blood anyway, in anycase. It does show that there has been some thought upon that topic though.

    In Erich Fromm and Edward O. Wilson's biophilious vs. necrophilious idea there's a dichotomy between the people who love life and living things and those who love dead things, want to tranform the living into the dead things (a crude example is taxadermy vs. photography perhaps) or love possessions more than they can or would people. Now that's not restricted to weapons by any stretch, some people love cards or collecting things more than they would persons but I often think of it with respect to weapons because of a lot of the legendary weapons or fighters myths I know associated with Irish, Norse and Scandinavian sagas and stories.

    Are you sure the dagger is intended as a weapon? I thought Sikhish was a largely anti-violence religion. I don't know. just wondering if carrying a dagger might be more of a utility thing. the way some people carry pocket knives to help the with certain tasks. Small knives are great for all kinds of things besides killing.

    As for me I don't own anything solely intended to be a weapon but I have carried my artist knife with me sometimes at night just as a precaution. I've been thinking about getting a pocketknife just because they come in handy.

  7. #17
    Senior Member cafe's Avatar
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    Only boffers. I use other methods for security and would get a scary-looking dog before I'd get any serious weapons. If I really need to take someone out, my mini-van is as effective as a gun and almost as satisfying as a knife and with my crappy driving skills it's possible I could sell it as an accident.

    I don't feel any philosophical or spiritual obligation to own or use weapons. If violence against strangers becomes more common in my area, I supposed I'd have to figure something out for pragmatic reasons. I hope things don't get that way.

    My husband carries a pocket knife, but not as a weapon. His maglite could double as a weapon in a pinch, but since he pulls trailers obviously filled with food, he's unlikely to get jacked at work.
    “There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old’s life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.”
    ~ John Rogers

  8. #18
    Mojibake sprinkles's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pseudo View Post
    Are you sure the dagger is intended as a weapon? I thought Sikhish was a largely anti-violence religion. I don't know. just wondering if carrying a dagger might be more of a utility thing. the way some people carry pocket knives to help the with certain tasks. Small knives are great for all kinds of things besides killing.

    As for me I don't own anything solely intended to be a weapon but I have carried my artist knife with me sometimes at night just as a precaution. I've been thinking about getting a pocketknife just because they come in handy.
    Baptized Sikhs are commanded by their faith to carry the dagger (though it isn't a requirement per se as some don't have one)

    It's to be drawn only for rituals or defense of self or another.

  9. #19
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    Do you have any philosophical or spiritual views which relate to weapons? Do you own or have you ever owned any weapons?

    I'm interested because I read a short time ago about Sikihism's religious obligation that its adherents carry daggers and thought about how that kind of thing has pretty much disappeared from Christianity or western society, I know someone who I was surprised owned a mace/morning star style weapon, had it in a closet near his front door were he kept his shoes and coats and who carried a pocket knife most of the time he was out of doors because he was perturbed by the idea that he could be killed randomly, like in a motoring accident or (this was during the troubles) bomb and would be unarmed when he died (I kid you not this was something that bothered him).
    I carry a pocket knife with me all the time, mostly for the tools. The beer bottle opener was quite popular when I was in grad school. I also have a sword and a sickle, made for me by an amateur blacksmith friend, and a couple old Army Ranger knives. That's all. I have no objection to weapons in principle, but personally won't have anything I'm not prepared to care for properly and actually use. I have never had any interest in firearms, but would like to try archery some day.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  10. #20
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by sprinkles View Post
    Baptized Sikhs are commanded by their faith to carry the dagger (though it isn't a requirement per se as some don't have one)

    It's to be drawn only for rituals or defense of self or another.
    I always wondered about that though, are you under a special obligation to defend yourself or others? Like is there a religious verison of stand your ground in effect or something?

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