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  1. #11
    failure to thrive AphroditeGoneAwry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AffirmitiveAnxiety View Post
    Tell you what, ill go out of my way to have sex with as many men as I cross paths with. If it suddenly turns me gay and makes me feel attracted to them...you are right.

    Did I propose having sex with people we cross paths with?

    This already happens. To men in prison long term.
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  2. #12
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AphroditeGoneAwry View Post
    Did I propose having sex with people we cross paths with?
    You did suggest experimentation. And im trying to get across the point that 'loving' people in a sexual way, who are not of your inherent biological attractions, is not going to change just because people drop definers and force attempted love.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
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  3. #13
    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    I'm capable of all those kinds of love. And for someone to tell me I'm lustful and that that is somehow a bad thing is kind of offensive. Not everyone shares your religion. There's nothing wrong with sex for its own sake.
    There's also nothing wrong with dressing up like Santa, patting your knees at Ryan Gosling and leering "The 12 Days of Christmas" at him until he calls the cops. *holds sides while they jiggle like a bowlful of jelly*

    Someone please come bail me out. Please.

    On a serious note, I think that being a sx-primary lends to the need to merge, regardless of "persuasion". It's whether or not you act on it selfishly that counts.
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  4. #14
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Domino View Post
    There's also nothing wrong with dressing up like Santa, patting your knees at Ryan Gosling and leering "The 12 Days of Christmas" at him until he calls the cops. *holds sides while they jiggle like a bowlful of jelly*

    Someone please come bail me out. Please.

    On a serious note, I think that being a sx-primary lends to the need to merge, regardless of "persuasion". It's whether or not you act on it selfishly that counts.
    So...what are you suggesting about it then? Being sexual without a romantic sort of love to go with it is not selfish.

  5. #15
    failure to thrive AphroditeGoneAwry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AffirmitiveAnxiety View Post
    You did suggest experimentation. And im trying to get across the point that 'loving' people in a sexual way, who are not of your inherent biological attractions, is not going to change just because people drop definers and force attempted love.

    Well, I did not mean to suggest experimentation in a lustful sense at all.

    Forcing love is not what I'm talking about. *sigh* Is this really that hard to understand??


    Experiencing love with someone and then having the urge to express that sexually goes WAY beyond the constraints of sexual identity.

    And one should not indulge lustful thoughts of anyone; should not give it any playtime at all. The eyes are the windows to the soul and one should protect one's soul.
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    The more one loves God, the more it is that having nothing in the world means everything, and the less one loves God, the more it is that having everything in the world means nothing.

    Do not resist an evil person, but to him who strikes you on the one cheek, offer also the other. ~Matthew 5:39

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  6. #16
    Wake, See, Sing, Dance Cellmold's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AphroditeGoneAwry View Post

    Experiencing love with someone and then having the urge to express that sexually goes WAY beyond the constraints of sexual identity.
    Sexual identity in terms of the literal definitions used to define them is a construct of our understanding. I dont disagree with that.

    However what those terms define DO exist and have been proven to exist. Homosexuality and Heterosexuality dont just vanish out of existance because we remove the definitions. Do we stop breathing if there is no word for air?

    As for love and expressing it sexually...I dont really care or mind. But if you are willing to have sex with men and women who you love and this is an expression of that love...then that means you were always attracted to both genders. You were always bi-sexual. You can of course ignore the term and disregard it, but you cannot deny the truth of your chemical attractions.

    The word exists because of what it explains, not the other way around.
    'One of (Lucas) Cranach's masterpieces, discussed by (Joseph) Koerner, is in it's self-referentiality the perfect expression of left-hemisphere emptiness and a precursor of post-modernism. There is no longer anything to point to beyond, nothing Other, so it points pointlessly to itself.' - Iain McGilChrist

    Suppose a tree fell down, Pooh, when we were underneath it?"
    "Suppose it didn't," said Pooh, after careful thought.
    Piglet was comforted by this.
    - A.A. Milne.

  7. #17
    The Black Knight Domino's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    So...what are you suggesting about it then? Being sexual without a romantic sort of love to go with it is not selfish.
    Ah no no, I wasn't implying anything at all. I was simply making an aside. As a sx, I have to battle this feeling of "MERGE!" constantly. Granted I'm emotionally and physically strained at the moment, so when I'm near people I love, the push to discard boundaries and be as close to them as possible is not always something I SHOULD respond to. I want to maintain THEIR meaning, even if meaning is confused, muddled up, or gone for me.

    I don't think mutual expression is necessarily selfish any more than I think withholding is always noble or brave.
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  8. #18
    Senior Member cafe's Avatar
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    OMG. Why?

    AGA, your ideas on sexuality tend to be unusual and extreme and you give the impression that everyone who doesn't do or see it your way is doing it/seeing it wrong.

    Most people identify as gay, straight, bi or something. I don't think there's anything wrong with that. I think God makes us with a potential range of sexuality. Environment, experiences, and choice can influence your development within that range. Sometimes someone can fall in love with someone who is not their ordinary preference. You get that sometimes. Just like you sometimes get albinos but most of the time, people don't have pink irises. So as short-hand we generally say people have brown, blue, green, grey, or hazel eyes. It's possible to have other colors. It's possible to get your eye poked out with a stick. But we don't have to include those things in every conversation about eye color, IMO.

    As a general rule, if you have a tendency to be attracted to (or lust after) a particular gender more than the other, you're probably best off with a partner of that gender. Just like if you prefer a particular body type, you probably shouldn't pursue people of the opposite body type. Assuming God gets involved in this kind of thing at this level, he's probably going to send you someone who is your type, since he made you in the first place.

    I'm born again and doctrinally Evangelical, so I understand what you're saying about the lust thing. A lot of people do not share those views. I don't think it's right to hold people that do not share those views to the dictates of those views, personally. It would be like someone giving me a hard time about eating sausage for breakfast because their religion forbids the consumption of pork or meat. Or for not covering my head when I left the house or using electricity in the house. I can eat sausage, go around bare-headed and use electricity in the house with a clear conscience because those things do not violate my beliefs. So it is with those who do not hold to Conservative Christian standards on sex.

    Personally, I've never fought the temptation to lust for a woman. I'm forty-two and I've only ever fought the temptation to lust for men. Generally stocky men with big butts. I consider that enough evidence to call myself straight and probably a chubby chaser. Not saying it could never change, but it's probably fairly unlikely at this point.
    “There are two novels that can change a bookish fourteen-year old’s life: The Lord of the Rings and Atlas Shrugged. One is a childish fantasy that often engenders a lifelong obsession with its unbelievable heroes, leading to an emotionally stunted, socially crippled adulthood, unable to deal with the real world. The other, of course, involves orcs.”
    ~ John Rogers

  9. #19
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Domino View Post
    Ah no no, I wasn't implying anything at all. I was simply making an aside. As a sx, I have to battle this feeling of "MERGE!" constantly. Granted I'm emotionally and physically strained at the moment, so when I'm near people I love, the push to discard boundaries and be as close to them as possible is not always something I SHOULD respond to. I want to maintain THEIR meaning, even if meaning is confused, muddled up, or gone for me.

    I don't think mutual expression is necessarily selfish any more than I think withholding is always noble or brave.
    Ah, ok. And I understand the sx thing, although I'm about as much sp I think.

    And @AffirmitiveAnxiety , you have made excellent points throughout this thread.

  10. #20
    can't handcuff the wind Z Buck McFate's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AphroditeGoneAwry View Post
    This is what I'm saying. Anyone that says "I'm homosexual" is excluding, via their personal prejudical feelings, a whole potential slew of mates. This is not God's will, but a humanistic notion. I can say all day that I'm attracted to introverted blond-haired blue-eyed tall males, but if God sends me a female, then what should I do? Say, not interested, God, but thanks anyway?



    My premise holds true because sex /= love. Love>sex. Love should lead.
    Quote Originally Posted by AphroditeGoneAwry View Post
    Everything is a choice. God gave us free will to choose to do anything. I'm simply proposing a more Godly way of looking at how we view ourselves sexually, and how we express our sexuality.



    I can see what you’re saying, the power of identity (and feeling like certain choices are already made for us because our ego clings to the identity) is strong, but I personally don’t have any identity issues wrapped strongly around ‘hetero’ and it still isn’t a choice for me. Maybe you don’t have a strong predilection for exclusively one direction or the other, so maybe it’s hard for you to imagine what it’s like for one to truly be there in others.

    There’s a certain organic truth under the labels and while using labels is often an attempt to sell a man-made construct about ‘human nature’ as an organic truth (“If we say we are X-sexual, we are trying to control who we love.”), that works in the other direction as well: getting rid of a label doesn’t get rid of whatever underlying organic truth the label was constructed to distinguish. I don’t think we really get to ‘decide’ what that underlying truth is; self actualization is more about uncovering it than deciding what it is.

    I actually wish what you are saying could be true- I’ve had far closer relationships with females, in the sense that I’ve felt far more understood and related infinitely better to female friends than any guys I’ve been in a relationship with- but the appetite just isn’t there. I’m somewhat unusual in that I don’t feel any lust for someone without a foundation of something like agape forming first (I really need that foundation of respect and awe for humanity to be there)- so I do agree with your premise that love should ‘lead’ (at least, for me)- but I disagree that we can ‘choose’ anything. Regardless of how strong the bond I form, lust really only follows that foundation in relation to males for me. Trying to ‘decide’ where that appetite ‘should’ be would ultimately be forcing the issue as much as letting the established labels make that decision for me.
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