User Tag List

First 123451353 Last

Results 21 to 30 of 581

  1. #21
    failure to thrive AphroditeGoneAwry's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    MBTI
    INfj
    Enneagram
    451 sx/so
    Socionics
    ENFj Ni
    Posts
    5,651

    Default

    Maybe gender if just sensitive to an external influences...Not highly sensitive perhaps, but somewhere around the middle-of-the-continuum or right-side-of-the-continuum sensitive.

    Maybe this saying is apt in the context of our recent past, because life forced us to adopt feminine and masculine traits that were more demarcated. To survive, men had to hunt, farm, provide food because women had to rear the young. The OP reflects the expression of these traits that manifested in our existence thus far, mainly for the most efficient, but also the most satisfying, survival.

    Now technology surrounding eating and working and living makes it so strong traditional psychosexual traits aren't so necessary, and we are not only seeing more tolerance of sexual identity, but slowly, more gender bending (or maybe 'swaying' is more apt still) as well, into more open sexuality and androgyny.


    I see this in my kids' generation regarding sexual and gender tolerance and expression, especially compared to our parents' generation. Quite a LOT of change actually, over a short period of time. But sexual fluidity (as in sex) seems to be more flexible than gender fluidity. Don't you think? I guess because male/femaleness is more primitive/innate in us than our sexuality. ?
    Ni/Ti/Fe/Si
    4w5 5w4 1w9
    ~Torah observant, Christ inspired~
    Life Path 11

    The more one loves God, the more it is that having nothing in the world means everything, and the less one loves God, the more it is that having everything in the world means nothing.

    Do not resist an evil person, but to him who strikes you on the one cheek, offer also the other. ~Matthew 5:39

    songofmary.wordpress.com


  2. #22
    Certified Sausage Smoker Elfboy's Avatar
    Join Date
    Nov 2008
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Enneagram
    5w4 sx/sp
    Socionics
    SLI None
    Posts
    9,635

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post

    Thoughts?
    I think this is lovely.
    It could be said that things of this nature have a bit of a heterosexual bias, but it could just as easily be platonic; and man or woman could be whichever of the feminine or masculine polarities you identify with (doesn't have to be biological).
    I think anyone who believes they can tell people what their highest calling is is fucking arrogant. that said, I do see a grain of truth to it (though in my case, it's protecting another guy )
    ENFP: We put the Fi in Fire
    ENFP
    5w4>1w9>2w1 Sx/Sp
    SEE-Fi
    Papa Bear
    Motivation: Dark Worker
    Alignment: Chaotic Neutral
    Chibi Seme
    MTG Color: black/red
    Male Archtype: King/Lover
    Sunburst!
    "You are a gay version of Gambit" Speed Gavroche
    "I wish that I could be affected by any hate, but I can't, cuz I just get affected by the bank" Chamillionaire

  3. #23
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    MBTI
    iNfj
    Enneagram
    6w5 sx/sp
    Posts
    4,042

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Thursday View Post
    I think that is a grand statement. However, I would like to see a little flexibility concerning gender roles.
    Right, like I say, anyone can chose whichever gender polarity they identify with. Actually, many Native American tribes greatly respected transgender (and probably hermaphrodite) people; they called people who switched gender roles berdache. Attitudes varied, but it was really cool where it was cool.

    http://southernmuse.hubpages.com/hub...ache-Tradition

    Quote Originally Posted by Rasofy View Post
    Made more sense before firearms.
    A bit more, yes. I think it's still relevant though.

  4. #24
    Post Human Post Qlip's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Enneagram
    4w5 sp/sx
    Posts
    9,488

    Default

    I find my own source, and I'd prefer to show someone else how to be safe in the world.. anything else seems patronizing outside of being a temporary measure. I reject those callings.

  5. #25
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    MBTI
    iNfj
    Enneagram
    6w5 sx/sp
    Posts
    4,042

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Mane View Post
    i believe the major difference between thinkers and feelers, underneath the Jungian definitions, is that thinkers are more likely to accept emotional dissonance then cognitive dissonance, thus creating a sense that thinkers are more "out of touch with their souls" because they experience a more difficult time accepting feelings that are not in tune with what they think, while feelers have a harder time accepting thoughts that are not in tune with what they feel. the flip side of these disadvantages are that thinkers can be perceived as more "one with their rational being" while feelers can be perceived as more "one with their emotional being" (while in truth both having merely opposite difficulties in being "one" with all aspects of their reality in the first place). because souls are more associated with one's emotional being, the later can be considered more spiritual.

    therefore it stands to reason that "women are more in touch with their souls" is a generalization which stems directly from a the higher feeler to thinkers ratio in women and in men, and because in the past, lower populations meant minorities in general where less significant, meaning rather then being perceived as a minority you would have being perceived as an isolated case within a village or settlement that does not truly reflect on the range of your gender as a whole.

    but today, as part of the recognizable and quite sizable NT minority within womankind, you are disqualified.

    now grab that spear and let's get bore hunting with the rest of the thinkers so that the women will have fur to cover their pregnant bellies for the winter.
    Lol. I agree with this, very good points! I do think women thinkers were still as prevalent; they just found outlets for their thinking which were in line with their gender roles more often, so it wasn't obvious, and they were taught to be more in touch with their feeling sides. It can be pretty complicated to make tools and such; probably women thinkers figured some of these things out, and other things like how to make protective garments, patch holes, fix housing units, etc. And women knew a lot about herbal medicine. And occasionally they did get out and hunt with the men (but probably not often). Or, very rarely, they started their own tribe of independent warrior women. :P

    Ok, I've got my spear and bow, let's go! Huh!

  6. #26
    meh Salomé's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    MBTI
    INTP
    Enneagram
    5w4 sx/sp
    Posts
    10,540

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Qlip View Post
    I find my own source, and I'd prefer to show someone else how to be safe in the world.. anything else seems patronizing outside of being a temporary measure. I reject those callings.
    +1
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

  7. #27
    mod love baby... Lady_X's Avatar
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Enneagram
    9w1 sx/so
    Posts
    18,086

    Default

    yeah totally patronizing to both.

    why can't it be he who shows you the way or she that protects you from the world...or you both finding your own way with each others encouragement.

    i say blech...
    There can’t be any large-scale revolution until there’s a personal revolution, on an individual level. It’s got to happen inside first.
    -Jim Morrison

  8. #28
    insert random title here Randomnity's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2007
    MBTI
    ISTP
    Enneagram
    6w5 sp/sx
    Posts
    9,489

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    I don't see a heterosexual bias, just the unwarranted implication that women are weak.
    +1
    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    Fair enough. It is true that women are physically weaker than men though on average, and men do more of the physical harm; so it is reasonable to expect a good man to protect women from other men. Imo.
    So women are weak and men are violent? That doesn't sound like a "beautiful proverb" to me, just more of the same old stereotypes.
    -end of thread-

  9. #29
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Enneagram
    5w6 sp/sx
    Posts
    17,568

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by greenfairy View Post
    Lol. I agree with this, very good points! I do think women thinkers were still as prevalent; they just found outlets for their thinking which were in line with their gender roles more often, so it wasn't obvious, and they were taught to be more in touch with their feeling sides. It can be pretty complicated to make tools and such; probably women thinkers figured some of these things out, and other things like how to make protective garments, patch holes, fix housing units, etc. And women knew a lot about herbal medicine. And occasionally they did get out and hunt with the men (but probably not often). Or, very rarely, they started their own tribe of independent warrior women.
    Some of the more recent anthropological accounts I have read attribute the development of agriculture to women. While men were off on hunting expeditions (or wars), women raised crops at home along with their children. Makes sense, and if correct shows that women were the first literal "breadwinners". The idea of men protecting women may have come to make survival sense in some contexts, but the "natural" protector is a mother with her young.
    I've been called a criminal, a terrorist, and a threat to the known universe. But everything you were told is a lie. The truth is, they've taken our freedom, our home, and our future. The time has come for all humanity to take a stand...

  10. #30
    philosopher wood nymph greenfairy's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    MBTI
    iNfj
    Enneagram
    6w5 sx/sp
    Posts
    4,042

    Default

    I knew this would provoke discussions of gender roles and "you can't tell me what my highest calling is." And I'm just curious what people think.

    Ok, here's how I see it. (Darn it, I started typing a bunch of really smart things and then lost it- let's see how much I remember.)

    Proverbs such as this are carefully worded to make you think. A lot of the wisdom lies in the interpretation.

    "Highest calling" depends on a couple of things. One, many native peoples (and pagans like myself) see Divinity as both immanent and transcendent. This means that Spirit is manifested in the world and as the world. As such, Spirit has both feminine and masculine polarities; and like the yin yang symbol each person has both polarities of energy. When people live this way as they are naturally led (and in the case of men not harming or neglecting women and those more vulnerable than them), it is conducive to great harmony and happiness; in this state the polarities are in harmony, Spirit is in harmony with itself- so this is very sacred- and in fact, nothing is more sacred. Thus, living in such a way as to produce harmony between masculine and feminine polarities is man and woman's highest calling. Two, many people feel pushed to constantly achieve; and the proverb teaches that all you really need to do is live in harmony.

    "Lead a man to his soul so as to unite him with Source" again refers to the polarity of Spirit. When we connect with another person, we are seeing a reflection of our soul. Spirit is in harmony with itself. What @Mane said is also relevant. Women on average seem to be more comfortable operating on instinct; men are socially conditioned to be disconnected with themselves in certain ways. This is reflected in the fact that women biologically have greater ability to access and use both hemispheres of their brains at once. So they tend to think more holistically and men tend to think in a more linear fashion. The feminine can help heal the damage done to the masculine from being disconnected with itself. And don't forget, since each person has both feminine and masculine, men can lead women to their souls and women can protect men. (And as @Elfboy mentioned, men can protect each other.)

    "Source" also needs to be understood. This is referring to Divinity, whatever you choose to call it. Native peoples saw Source as both immanent and transcendent, as the source of all, but also as manifesting in and as the world. It is the Earth and Sky, nature as the sacred creator of life, and all the life energy which flows through it; it is collective consciousness, Spirit in all its forms, and every being which possesses life. So uniting with Source is as simple as a spirit being in harmony with itself and with other spirits while being in harmony with the natural world. (By this definition, @Qlip, your argument would be irrelevant.)

    When man protects woman, or the masculine protects the feminine (regardless of biological sex), the more vulnerable person feels safe, and is in greater harmony. That person's life energy is higher when they are safe, and this is sacred because Spirit is protected. What @sprinkles said is also something I wanted to mention; protecting something is not condescending, but denoting value. We all protect what we feel has value. And since Spirit manifests as the life essence in living beings, protecting any human or animal within the context of balance is being in proper relation to the sacred (however you conceive of Divinity). Protection is also necessary for all kinds of vulnerable people: those who are sick, elderly, injured, going through emotionally traumatic times, young children, and your tribe. No one would argue that protecting people in these instances is patronizing. And of course, it doesn't mean allowing another person to be lazy, or interfering with their ability to freely live their lives; it means should a potential source of harm appear, you are ready to step into the situation and help remove it. It should be pointed out that in tribal cultures before technology, life was a lot more dangerous for everyone. Women tended to have more babies, and in this state they and their children were more physically vulnerable. It's true that women are perfectly capable of taking care of themselves most of the time, but with most of the men off hunting and fishing and doing whatever else they did, women mostly cared for the children; so they could use some help in taking care of themselves. In modern times it's easy to forget how complex and interconnected life was, because technology has allowed us to seemingly be more independent. Things have changed a lot, but I think the underlying principles are still true. Men still do more of the physical harm, and women are still on average more physically vulnerable. And even though many women choose not to have children, it still happens. While we are capable of doing anything we put our minds to, we could still use some help, and we like to feel safe. And though men are perfectly capable of living however they want, and being in harmony with themselves, many of them find themselves fighting a lot of external battles and disconnecting with themselves; and they could use some healing and nurturing.

    A wise piece of advice for how to live does not command. It gently shows the natural flow of things and the benefits of choosing to go with the natural flow. We can apply this to our lives in whatever way suits our individual circumstances.

Similar Threads

  1. Older woman younger man
    By Butterfly in forum The Bonfire
    Replies: 80
    Last Post: 05-17-2012, 06:27 AM
  2. [NF] F woman and T man
    By INTPness in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 05-15-2010, 03:22 AM
  3. [NF] If you had infinite money,land, and man-power... What would you do for fun?
    By ObeyBunny in forum The NF Idyllic (ENFP, INFP, ENFJ, INFJ)
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: 03-10-2010, 12:05 AM
  4. The good life and man's relation to society
    By SolitaryWalker in forum Philosophy and Spirituality
    Replies: 63
    Last Post: 07-23-2008, 11:43 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO