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What do you think of the wall of text tl:dr development?

A

Anew Leaf

Guest
I'm not sure this generalisation holds for all introverts.
IME, INTPs (at least) highly value, and actively cultivate, brevity.

o_O have you seen some of the walls of text crafted by the INTPs on this site?

It's..... rather alarming.
 
W

WALMART

Guest
[MENTION=7280]Lark[/MENTION]

i cannot stand to read more than three paragraphs. four is pushing it, it better be damned interesting.

but when someone writes back six paragraphs to my one, something is wrong.
 

prplchknz

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because 99% of the time the wall of text is boring and could have been summed up in 2 sentences. Sometimes I'll try to read a wall of text and than i'm like yeah....no. I don't expect people to read my posts, and i'd forgive them if i wrote a novella on here and they didn't read it. Honestly I'm not that interesting.
 

UniqueMixture

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I didnt know that it meant too long : didnt read until lately and the wall of text thing, what do you think of them?

I can understand someone wanting broken up text or forum ettiquette to a certain extent but does it really mean that people dont pay attention anymore or wont concentrate? If its difficult or demanding are people in the west just inclined to give up and avoid it? Is slacking a cultural norm?

The thing is it shows a lack of effort on the part of the poster. If they do not wish to engage with the content they're posting enough to perform an analysis on it or provide some original feedback, then obviously it cannot be THAT important to them and so why should I consider it important? The alternative is that the individual is under developed and so why should I listen to them? Or, possibly they're intellectually arrogant and "preaching" at me. Why would I want to be the agent of bolstering that person's ego?
 

ygolo

My termites win
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The thing is it shows a lack of effort on the part of the poster. If they do not wish to engage with the content they're posting enough to perform an analysis on it or provide some original feedback, then obviously it cannot be THAT important to them and so why should I consider it important? The alternative is that the individual is under developed and so why should I listen to them? Or, possibly they're intellectually arrogant and "preaching" at me. Why would I want to be the agent of bolstering that person's ego?

Others have stated similar things. Why do you assume that someone who has posted a much longer post actually took less time to make it? If anything, it seems, on average, that they would have taken longer to make it.

A longer post means that the individual is "underdeveloped"? Care to elaborate on this?

There are some posts I find interesting, other things I don't. Some are longer, some are shorter. Why do you assume a longer post means they are intellectually arrogant and "preaching" at you? We often have debates on forums.

It takes more time to read a longer post. That is certainly true. But I think it takes more time to make one too.
 

UniqueMixture

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Others have stated similar things. Why do you assume that someone who has posted a much longer post actually took less time to make it? If anything, it seems, on average, that they would have taken longer to make it.

A longer post means that the individual is "underdeveloped"? Care to elaborate on this?

There are some posts I find interesting, other things I don't. Some are longer, some are shorter. Why do you assume a longer post means they are intellectually arrogant and "preaching" at you? We often have debates on forums.

It takes more time to read a longer post. That is certainly true. But I think it takes more time to make one too.

I was referring to long texts that are just from other sources like a 4 page news article without the individual's commentary. I value long post's that the individual THEMSELVES took the time to type. It shows thoughtfulness, deliberation, and ability to reflect. When a person is coming from that sort of space I feel their thoughts are more prone to genuine honesty and I value them more.
 
G

garbage

Guest
Someone had mentioned "signal-to-noise," and I think that's an apt analogy.

Long-winded talks or posts aren't necessarily bad in and of themselves. In fact, I've found that I'm terrible at elevator pitches and 5-minute presentations, because I feel as though I can't fully explain an idea or present what I'd regard as necessary context.

I actually fare much better with 30 minute to an hour and a half talks. But I still have to make them interesting, organized, and relevant.
 
Joined
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Someone had mentioned "signal-to-noise," and I think that's an apt analogy.

Long-winded talks or posts aren't necessarily bad in and of themselves. In fact, I've found that I'm terrible at elevator pitches and 5-minute presentations, because I feel as though I can't fully explain an idea or present what I'd regard as necessary context.

I actually fare much better with 30 minute to an hour and a half talks. But I still have to make them interesting, organized, and relevant.

Exactly. To answer ygolo, no one is saying you have to turn War And Peace into a Cliffs Notes version. But who would have made it through War and Peace if it was a long wall of text on a scroll with no paragraphs or chapters? In addition, acceptable length is determined by depth. If you have a long post that takes a long time to elucidate, fine. But the argument here is about people who write forever to basically say "I don't like that".
 

ygolo

My termites win
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I was referring to long texts that are just from other sources like a 4 page news article without the individual's commentary. I value long post's that the individual THEMSELVES took the time to type. It shows thoughtfulness, deliberation, and ability to reflect. When a person is coming from that sort of space I feel their thoughts are more prone to genuine honesty and I value them more.

Oh. OK. That is different.

Sometimes, I quote things from articles that I find interesting (especially news and science related), and provide the link. In many of these situations, I hold off on giving my own opinion till others have responded. I've noticed that I have an unusual high rate of ending threads or not getting responses when I state my opinion.

If nobody responds, I may be disappointed because I found things interesting, and was hoping to discuss things.
 

UniqueMixture

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Oh. OK. That is different.

Sometimes, I quote things from articles that I find interesting (especially news and science related), and provide the link. In many of these situations, I hold off on giving my own opinion till others have responded. I've noticed that I have an unusual high rate of ending threads or not getting responses when I state my opinion.

If nobody responds, I may be disappointed because I found things interesting, and was hoping to discuss things.

I think in some cases you bring up "touchy" issues and because you are treating them seriously it brings up fears in other people. It's not that people don't like or don't wish to engage with you about what you're talking about, it is that it can be painful to integrate thoughts and feelings into ourselves that deal with basic emotions that we have. Often people use abstract topics as a way of dealing with issues of identity. For example some of the conservatives on this site strike me as very good people who wish to create a genuine dialogue with liberals in order to create an integrated view of politics. However the problem is that the way people fundamentally feel about politics is not about policy notes and so forth, it is about -relationships-. How do you relate to this person/group? What does this person group symbolize? What does this person/group symbolize about YOURSELF? If their worldview is correct, how does that make you FEEL? etc. This happens not just with politics, but also ideas about class, race, sex, religion, etc etc.
 

ygolo

My termites win
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Someone had mentioned "signal-to-noise," and I think that's an apt analogy.

Long-winded talks or posts aren't necessarily bad in and of themselves. In fact, I've found that I'm terrible at elevator pitches and 5-minute presentations, because I feel as though I can't fully explain an idea or present what I'd regard as necessary context.

I actually fare much better with 30 minute to an hour and a half talks. But I still have to make them interesting, organized, and relevant.

I agree that there are places and situations where brevity is important. But I think how long or short something is can vary based on the topic and the forum being used.

We have had plenty of long, involved, and interesting (to me at least) discussions in the philosophy sub-forum in the past. This does seem less likely in 2012 than in 2008 for instance. It is just an impression of mine.

Exactly. To answer ygolo, no one is saying you have to turn War And Peace into a Cliffs Notes version. But who would have made it through War and Peace if it was a long wall of text on a scroll with no paragraphs or chapters? In addition, acceptable length is determined by depth. If you have a long post that takes a long time to elucidate, fine. But the argument here is about people who write forever to basically say "I don't like that".

I believe the distinction between signal and nose is largely subjective. War and Peace, for instance, I found to be incredibly boring.

But the point about paragraphs, I agree with.

My hypothesis is that it has to do with the mechanics of reading online versus in a book. Laptops and computer screens in general are much wider than pages of books. To accommodate for this, there needs to be more space between paragraphs, otherwise the eyes end up rereading the same things. This can be frustrating even if the reader doesn't notice it happening.

I think in some cases you bring up "touchy" issues and because you are treating them seriously it brings up fears in other people. It's not that people don't like or don't wish to engage with you about what you're talking about, it is that it can be painful to integrate thoughts and feelings into ourselves that deal with basic emotions that we have. Often people use abstract topics as a way of dealing with issues of identity. For example some of the conservatives on this site strike me as very good people who wish to create a genuine dialogue with liberals in order to create an integrated view of politics. However the problem is that the way people fundamentally feel about politics is not about policy notes and so forth, it is about -relationships-. How do you relate to this person/group? What does this person group symbolize? What does this person/group symbolize about YOURSELF? If their worldview is correct, how does that make you FEEL? etc. This happens not just with politics, but also ideas about class, race, sex, religion, etc etc.

No talk about religion or politics in polite company? that sort of thing?

I would love if people could just be honest without having to put their relationships at risk.

Why does it have to be like--"You don't believe the Earth is flat? Begone." Why can't it be, "You don't believe the Earth is flat? Why?"
 

UniqueMixture

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I agree that there are places and situations where brevity is important. But I think how long or short something is can vary based on the topic and the forum being used.

We have had plenty of long, involved, and interesting (to me at least) discussions in the philosophy sub-forum in the past. This does seem less likely in 2012 than in 2008 for instance. It is just an impression of mine.t



I believe the distinction between signal and nose is largely subjective. War and Peace, for instance, I found to be incredibly boring.

But the point about paragraphs, I agree with.

My hypothesis is that it has to do with the mechanics of reading online versus in a book. Laptops and computer screens in general are much wider than pages of books. To accommodate for this, there needs to be more space between paragraphs, otherwise the eyes end up rereading the same things. This can be frustrating even if the reader doesn't notice it happening.



No talk about religion or politics in polite company? that sort of thing?

I would love if people could just be honest without having to put their relationships at risk.

Why does it have to be like--"You don't believe the Earth is flat? Begone." Why can't it be, "You don't believe the Earth is flat? Why?"


People can't get over themselves
 

Salomé

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o_O have you seen some of the walls of text crafted by the INTPs on this site?

It's..... rather alarming.
There may be exceptions, but I haven't noticed a pattern of verbosity amongst INTPs. Perhaps that's just because I am more at ease with INTP communication and so the reward/effort ratio is in my favour. Unlike some long-winded NF posts - full of ellipses and half-digested thoughts upon we are forced to impose some kind of structure/fill-in-the-blanks. :p

Ultimately, one should cut one's cloth appropriately. Some topics merit lengthy OPs/ responses. Most do not (in this medium which, after all, is designed to facilitate a conversational tone.)
 

Nijntje

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I love tl;dr, i fucking hate a wall 'o text. How hard is it to make paragraphs people?!!!!!!
 

prplchknz

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this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text this is a wall of text

this isn't a wall of text this isn't a wall of text this isn't a wall of text this isn't a wall of text

this isn't a wall of text this isn't a wall of text this isn't a wall of text this isn't a wall of text this isn't a wall of text this isn't a wall of text this isn't a wall of text this isn't a wall of text this isn't a wall of text this isn't a wall of text this isn't a wall of text

this isn't a wall of text this isn't a wall of text this isn't a wall of text this isn't a wall of text this isn't a wall of text this isn't a wall of text this isn't a wall of text this isn't

a wall of text this isn't a wall of text this isn't a wall of text this isn't a wall of text this isn't a wall of text this isn't a wall of text this isn't a wall of text this isn't a wall of text

any questions?
 

Nijntje

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[MENTION=360]prplchknz[/MENTION] , you illustrate my point exactly. <3
 
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