User Tag List

First 71516171819 Last

Results 161 to 170 of 229

  1. #161
    Post Human Post Qlip's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Enneagram
    4w5 sp/sx
    Posts
    9,483

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    Tell that to Spartacus.

    Spartacus didn't believe in slavery. In fact Spartacus and tens of thousands of his followers attacked the Roman Legions and defeated them time and time again in order to free the slaves.

    And Jesus was not a follower of Spartacus. In fact Jesus supported slavery, saying out of one side of his mouth, "Render unto Caesar the things (slaves) that are Caesar's"; and out of the other side of his mouth, "Render unto God the things that are God's".
    It's still not the same animal. I didn't say it was a good state of existence. I imagine there were not many good states of existence. To mention slavery is not to support it, it's just to relate to the reality those people whom the stories are being told to.

    Note, this is not an endorsement of Jesus as divine. But, even if he were, then it's still really not a valid point. Christianity was a minority religion, it never was meant to or expected to be a religion of the ruling class.

    You're internal references are very coarse.

  2. #162
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    18,529
    Quote Originally Posted by Qlip View Post
    it never was meant to or expected to be a religion of the ruling class.
    Oh please, the Emperor Constantine made Christianity the religion of the ruling class.

    And look, nothing has changed in 2,000 years, as Christianity is the religion of choice of the greatest and most powerful Empire the world has ever seen, the United States of America, an Empire based on slavery.

  3. #163
    Post Human Post Qlip's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Enneagram
    4w5 sp/sx
    Posts
    9,483

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    Oh please, the Emperor Constantine made Christianity the religion of the ruling class.
    .
    Exactly.. and Christianity hasn't really quite made sense since, except to maybe certain people.. the minority.

  4. #164
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    18,529
    Quote Originally Posted by Qlip View Post
    You're internal references are very coarse.
    Of course the Roman slave owners regarded Spartacus as coarse, and Jesus as meek and mild.

  5. #165
    Post Human Post Qlip's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Enneagram
    4w5 sp/sx
    Posts
    9,483

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    Of course the Roman slave owners regarded Spartacus as coarse, and Jesus as meek and mild.
    Okay. EDIT: G'night.

  6. #166
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    18,529
    Quote Originally Posted by Qlip View Post
    Exactly.. and Christianity hasn't really quite made sense since, except to maybe certain people.. the minority.
    What! You are saying for 2,000 years Christianity hasn't made sense, yet it was Christianity that founded the great Universities.

    You are saying Christianity only makes sense to the minority while Christianity is the religion of the most powerful civilization the world has ever seen, the civilization of the West.

  7. #167
    Member CreativeCait's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    MBTI
    PING
    Posts
    81

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    I can only quote the Bible, Matthew 27:25, "Then answered all the people, and said, His blood be on us, and on our children".
    This is called the blood libel against the Jews, and for 2,000 years the Jews were called deicides, that is, the killers of the deity.
    And the holocaust was justified by ordinary christians, who said of the Jews that, "They are Christ killers".
    @CreativeCait
    You are using that quote out of Matthew, out of its original context and applying C20th historical events and contexts onto it.
    You need to interpret the bible in the context it was written in and the purpose it was written for. If you read the rest of the passage in whole, you will understand it is not about followers of Christ hating Jews for killing Jesus. It is about the fact that given the chance almost all of us would kill God. Many Christians attest that if they were in the crowd, in the context of that time and place not knowing what they know now, that there is a great possibility that they would call for Jesus to be crucified too. And that passage relates to the rest of Matthew 27, contrasting with the end, when after Jesus dies the temple is torn, the earth shakes, the rocks split, tombs were open, saints were raised from the dead and people realised, uh, he actually is the Son of God, ooops. Matthew 27:54 “When the centurion and those who were with him, keeping watch over Jesus, saw the earthquake and what took place, they were filled with awe and said, “Truly this was the Son of God!”
    The holocaust was initiated by Hitler, not any Christian church. Yes, some of the perpetrators of the holocaust and Nazism were Christians and some didn’t believe in God. Nazi-ism was a racist and ideological war not a “cruisaide” to avenge Christ’s death. DUH. As for the fact that there were some Christians who supported the holocaust saying that Jews were ‘the Christ Killers’ all I can say is there are crazies everywhere...some of them happen to be religious and use religion for their own agendas.

    A) Why would any Christian logically be anti-Semitic when Jesus was Jewish??
    B) Why would any Christian logically be anti-Semitic when they are God’s chosen people??
    C) Why would any Christian logically hate Judaism, when half our Bible is from the Torah and we have great reverence for so many of the same people, stories and values??

    The fact that Jewish people killed Christ has not really been a big issue for Christian Churches since it happened. And if you read into the blood libel thing further, you will see that it in its first instances it was some weird mythology that happened in a few isolated places, unconnected to each other, where people mistakenly thought Jewish people were killing Christians. The Nazis created all kinds of hype and hysteria in their propaganda using whatever was at their means of disposal and so it makes sense they would pounce on some ideas of ‘blood libel’ previously heard of and spin them up into a big slight against Jewish people, to further their campaign. They were just using Christianity as an instrument for their own Puritanic agendas, which obviously spun out of control. Nazi-ism and the Holocaust was about racial Puritanism, anti-Semitism and Hitler’s power-hungry thirst for power and the creation of his personal utopia not about the fact that Jewish people killed Jesus. To link someone like Jesus who cared for some of the most disadvantaged people in society with genocide committed almost two centuries later by an Authoritarian Regime without any real affiliation to Christianity is offensive to Christians as well as just plain ridiculous when you take into account the evidence.

    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    Since WW II and the Universal Declaration of Human Rights in 1948, Christians have not accused the Jews of being Christ killers.
    The only ones accusing Jews of being Christ killers today are Islamists.
    And so it is no wonder that 57 Islamic States have openly and publicly rejected the Universal Declaration of Human Rights.
    You are getting terribly off-topic from the OP. If you want to debate stuff like this start a new thread instead of derailing this one by bringing up The Holocaust.

  8. #168
    Member CreativeCait's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2012
    MBTI
    PING
    Posts
    81

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by UniqueMixture View Post
    @CreativeCait imo the benefits of christianity can be found in other faith systems with much less social costs. Buddhism is a great example, however it has its own problems. My philosophy is more or less "it's silly to have A philosophy." Different mentalities exist to operate on different tasks. The most useful mentality is the one that creates a vision for yourself so that you can have lifelong goals that you pursue that make you, family, friends, and others live better lives. If you do it right, you even get the chance to make a permanent positive long term impact on society, the world, and all the universes that could ever be. To me Christianity is too human-centric/geo-centric to truly be applicable for all. Worse than this (imo) it denies the divinity of the human spirit. WE are beautiful gestalts of body, environment, sensation and affect. You would have me give that up for a STUPID BACKWARDS CULT that could never accept me? Go **** yourself
    That’s an interesting philosophy. I’ve never come across anyone like you before.

    As an aside, why are you acting so angry at me? Seems unnecessary...

    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    Jesus came from a spoken culture - in other words Jesus was illiterate.
    And Jesus was single in a Judaic culture based on marriage.
    And Jesus chose only men to be his disciples.
    I don’t really understand what your point is.

    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    And rather than choosing to be crucified, Jesus, in Matthew 26:39, falls on his face praying, "My Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me; nevertheless, not as I will, but as you will.” Jesus did not choose to be crucified, he was tortured to death by his father.
    No. Jesus chose to be crucified, but he didn’t want to be crucified. He asked his father to relieve him of what he had to do. Being the Son of God, Jesus could have released himself from suffering and death at any point, but chose not to because he loved humankind. Jesus was not tortured by his father but by humans.

  9. #169
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    18,529

    Gott mit uns

    Quote Originally Posted by CreativeCait View Post
    You are using that quote out of Matthew, out of its original context and applying C20th historical events and contexts onto it.
    Christianity blamed the death of Jesus on the Jews from the very beginning. And this was preached every easter in Christian churches and afterwards the congregation would go out and commit a pogrom against the Jews.

    This went on for two thousand years preparing Christians for the great pogrom, the holocaust of the Jews.

    As the Jews were forced to kneel before the German soldiers during the holocaust, the Jews could read the Christian motto on German belt buckle. It read, "Gott mit uns". And the God was the Christian God.

  10. #170
    Dreaming the life onemoretime's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    MBTI
    3h50
    Socionics
    ILE
    Posts
    4,460

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    Christianity blamed the death of Jesus on the Jews from the very beginning. And this was preached every easter in Christian churches and afterwards the congregation would go out and commit a pogrom against the Jews.

    This went on for two thousand years preparing Christians for the great pogrom, the holocaust of the Jews.

    As the Jews were forced to kneel before the German soldiers during the holocaust, the Jews could read the Christian motto on German belt buckle. It read, "Gott mit uns". And the God was the Christian God.
    Which, incidentally, was also the Hebrew God. Weird stuff, this religion.

Similar Threads

  1. Why Do People Believe in Ghosts?
    By Tellenbach in forum Philosophy and Spirituality
    Replies: 43
    Last Post: 09-19-2014, 09:16 AM
  2. Why I do not believe in God
    By SolitaryWalker in forum Philosophy and Spirituality
    Replies: 248
    Last Post: 01-09-2013, 09:40 PM
  3. Why I no longer believe in MBTI
    By murkrow in forum Myers-Briggs and Jungian Cognitive Functions
    Replies: 72
    Last Post: 03-06-2011, 11:24 AM
  4. Prophecy In Christianity: Related to Ni?
    By Usehername in forum Philosophy and Spirituality
    Replies: 18
    Last Post: 12-18-2007, 06:32 AM
  5. Do you believe in a higher power?
    By ygolo in forum The Bonfire
    Replies: 23
    Last Post: 09-03-2007, 08:58 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO