User Tag List

First 8910111220 Last

Results 91 to 100 of 229

  1. #91
    Senior Member Forever_Jung's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Enneagram
    6
    Posts
    2,340

    Default

    From Twain's "The Mysterious Stranger""

    A God who could make good children as easily as bad, yet preferred to make bad ones; who could have made every one of them happy, yet never made a single happy one; who made them prize their bitter life, yet stingily cut it short; who gave his angels eternal happiness unearned, yet required his other children to earn it; who gave his angels painless lives, yet cursed his other children with biting miseries and maladies of mind and body; who mouths justice, and invented hell — mouths mercy, and invented hell — mouths Golden Rules and forgiveness multiplied by seventy times seven, and invented hell; who mouths morals to other people, and has none himself; who frowns upon crimes, yet commits them all; who created man without invitation, then tries to shuffle the responsibility for man's acts upon man, instead of honorably placing it where it belongs, upon himself; and finally, with altogether divine obtuseness, invites his poor abused slave to worship him!...There is no God, no universe, no human race, no earthly life, no heaven, no hell. It is all a Dream, a grotesque and foolish dream. Nothing exists but you. And You are but a Thought — a vagrant Thought, a useless Thought, a homeless Thought, wandering forlorn among the empty eternities.

  2. #92
    LL P. Stewie Beorn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Posts
    4,804

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Forever_Jung View Post
    From Twain's "The Mysterious Stranger"

    "A God who could make good children as easily as bad, yet preferred to make bad ones; who could have made every one of them happy, yet never made a single happy one; who made them prize their bitter life, yet stingily cut it short; who gave his angels eternal happiness unearned, yet required his other children to earn it; who gave his angels painless lives, yet cursed his other children with biting miseries and maladies of mind and body; who mouths justice, and invented hell — mouths mercy, and invented hell — mouths Golden Rules and forgiveness multiplied by seventy times seven, and invented hell; who mouths morals to other people, and has none himself; who frowns upon crimes, yet commits them all; who created man without invitation, then tries to shuffle the responsibility for man's acts upon man, instead of honorably placing it where it belongs, upon himself; and finally, with altogether divine obtuseness, invites his poor abused slave to worship him!...There is no God, no universe, no human race, no earthly life, no heaven, no hell. It is all a Dream, a grotesque and foolish dream. Nothing exists but you. And You are but a Thought — a vagrant Thought, a useless Thought, a homeless Thought, wandering forlorn among the empty eternities."
    “God gave us minds to think with and hearts to thank with. Instead we use our hearts to think about the world as we would like it to have been, and we use our minds to come up with rationalizations for our ingratitude. We are a murmuring, discontented, unhappy, ungrateful people. And because we think we want salvation from our discontents...” - Douglas Wilson
    Take the weakest thing in you
    And then beat the bastards with it
    And always hold on when you get love
    So you can let go when you give it

  3. #93
    Blah Orangey's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2008
    MBTI
    ESTP
    Enneagram
    6w5
    Socionics
    SLE
    Posts
    6,364

    Default

    Hmmm, I like the Mysterious Stranger quote better, I think.
    Artes, Scientia, Veritasiness

  4. #94
    Senior Member Forever_Jung's Avatar
    Join Date
    May 2009
    Enneagram
    6
    Posts
    2,340

    Default

    I dunno who Douglas Wilson is, but his quote sounds like a shitty parent shaming his child, when the child complains of abuse: You're lucky we even feed you! If you want our eatings, then accept our beatings!

    Edit: Also, I wasn't asserting my beliefs by quoting Twain, I was just demonstrating his cynical attitude, as was being discussed. Just to clear up any confusion. It's quite a quote though!

  5. #95
    LL P. Stewie Beorn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Posts
    4,804

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Forever_Jung View Post
    I dunno who Douglas Wilson is, but his quote sounds like a shitty parent shaming his child, when the child complains of abuse: You're lucky we even feed you! If you want our eatings, then accept our beatings!

    Edit: Also, I wasn't asserting my beliefs by quoting Twain, I was just demonstrating his cynical attitude, as was being discussed. Just to clear up any confusion. It's quite a quote though!
    It's only shitty treatment if you believe there is abuse. I'm sure you've seen bratty kids whining in situations where they have no right to complain. Of course there can only be abuse if there is a God in the first place.

    Whuch reminds me of another Wilson quote that addresses Twain's attitude:

    There are two tenants to atheism:
    1) There is no God
    2) I hate him.
    Take the weakest thing in you
    And then beat the bastards with it
    And always hold on when you get love
    So you can let go when you give it

  6. #96
    Post Human Post Qlip's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Enneagram
    4w5 sp/sx
    Posts
    9,479

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Beefeater View Post
    It's only shitty treatment if you believe there is abuse. I'm sure you've seen bratty kids whining in situations where they have no right to complain. Of course there can only be abuse if there is a God in the first place.

    Whuch reminds me of another Wilson quote that addresses Twain's attitude:

    There are two tenants to atheism:
    1) There is no God
    2) I hate him.
    You don't give that original Twain quote enough credit to read its subleties. If there is a God, then all suffering can be attributed to him. Therefore he (Twain, or a fictional character?? I haven't read that.) denies there is a God. But since there is no God, there is nothing.

    Anyway, maybe it's a type of lament, but it's not a simple FU to God.

  7. #97
    LL P. Stewie Beorn's Avatar
    Join Date
    Dec 2008
    Posts
    4,804

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Qlip View Post
    You don't give that original Twain quote enough credit to read its subleties. If there is a God, then all suffering can be attributed to him. Therefore he (Twain, or a fictional character?? I haven't read that.) denies there is a God. But since there is no God, there is nothing.

    Anyway, maybe it's a type of lament, but it's not a simple FU to God.
    I don't really believe he believed there is nothing.
    Take the weakest thing in you
    And then beat the bastards with it
    And always hold on when you get love
    So you can let go when you give it

  8. #98
    failure to thrive AphroditeGoneAwry's Avatar
    Join Date
    Feb 2009
    MBTI
    INfj
    Enneagram
    451 sx/so
    Socionics
    ENFj Ni
    Posts
    5,651

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Qlip View Post
    You don't give that original Twain quote enough credit to read its subleties. If there is a God, then all suffering can be attributed to him. Therefore he (Twain, or a fictional character?? I haven't read that.) denies there is a God. But since there is no God, there is nothing.

    Anyway, maybe it's a type of lament, but it's not a simple FU to God.
    I haven't been thinking about God very long, as I was a self-proclaimed 'atheist' for 20+ years, but do you believe that God gives us free will?

    I do, and if so, that would mean that God gives us the ability to allow the 'Devil' to work in us and to inflict pain and suffering on ourselves and others. Therefore, I don't think we can attribute any suffering to God, unless it is suffering of the kind that is going to make us stronger or benefit us in the long run, or is His will in some way. I think some suffering, perhaps most, is from elsewhere. The Devil, for lack of a better term.

    And that if we all lived as close to God's will as we could, merging it with our will, not against it, we would likely actually 'suffer' very little.


    I think we can only attribute Love to God. Not suffering.


    EDIT: If you were interpreting Twain, etc., I'm sorry. Just ignore my post, if you like.
    Ni/Ti/Fe/Si
    4w5 5w4 1w9
    ~Torah observant, Christ inspired~
    Life Path 11

    The more one loves God, the more it is that having nothing in the world means everything, and the less one loves God, the more it is that having everything in the world means nothing.

    Do not resist an evil person, but to him who strikes you on the one cheek, offer also the other. ~Matthew 5:39

    songofmary.wordpress.com


  9. #99
    Post Human Post Qlip's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jul 2010
    MBTI
    ENFP
    Enneagram
    4w5 sp/sx
    Posts
    9,479

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Beefeater View Post
    I don't really believe he believed there is nothing.
    It's a quote, I don't understand the context. I don't know if I am projecting, but I feel that I understand the feeling behind it. Maybe I am wrong.

    It feels like an expression of dissatsifaction. The same type of dissatisfaction that I had being raised believing in a deity, but having all my senses and reasoning tell me that if a diety exists then he should be rejected, and if a diety doesn't exist, then living is emptiness. I've reconciled with those feelings. I can't even begin to speak for Twain, except that I think I he understood this feeling at some point, and at some other point he wrote it in a book. I don't know what point in his life this was, people change their points of views all through their time.

    I think it's a very expressive passage. I don't think it's childish whining.

  10. #100

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Forever_Jung View Post
    From Twain's "The Mysterious Stranger""
    Isnt the mysterious stranger the devil?

Similar Threads

  1. Why Do People Believe in Ghosts?
    By Tellenbach in forum Philosophy and Spirituality
    Replies: 43
    Last Post: 09-19-2014, 09:16 AM
  2. Why I do not believe in God
    By SolitaryWalker in forum Philosophy and Spirituality
    Replies: 248
    Last Post: 01-09-2013, 09:40 PM
  3. Why I no longer believe in MBTI
    By murkrow in forum Myers-Briggs and Jungian Cognitive Functions
    Replies: 72
    Last Post: 03-06-2011, 11:24 AM
  4. Prophecy In Christianity: Related to Ni?
    By Usehername in forum Philosophy and Spirituality
    Replies: 18
    Last Post: 12-18-2007, 06:32 AM
  5. Do you believe in a higher power?
    By ygolo in forum The Bonfire
    Replies: 23
    Last Post: 09-03-2007, 08:58 AM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO