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  1. #181
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    It is a false religion and pantheon, if it is real then those are lesser deities than my God.


    May Hel have mercy on your in the afterlife.

  2. #182
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AphroditeGoneAwry View Post
    Well, when the Bible speaks to how God is Love especially, but I agree that God can punish as well. The Divine message being that God is the three O's...When that is supported in the Bible, I concur, and enjoy reading it. But when the Bible says something completely antithetical to how I know or feel God to be, then, yeah, I have to go with my own interpretation. Such as there needing to be one way for salvation only--through Christ, etc. Or that the be all, end all of believing in God is to get to Heaven. I think the point is to create Heaven on earth inasmuch as that is possible. At least it's a nice goal. The way the Bible holds Heaven up as the pinnacle of Utopia, makes me just think of dangling carrots....for the masses, and is but another example which makes me feel like the early authors/disciples were missing the whole point of God (at times).
    My beliefs ^

    I would also venture the beliefs of many of those who crafted the bible, although the bible is not the only core text of christianity, not in my opinion and I'd include a number of books personally which the Church wouldnt but which I believe are divinely inspired too (even one or two by atheists, bizzaro as that may sound).

  3. #183
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by 93JC View Post


    May Hel have mercy on your in the afterlife.
    It would be such an adventure to discover all that norse mythology was true, I'd be rescued by Jesus and co eventually I'm sure but I'd be able to see what the warriors table was like and feast for a bit.

  4. #184
    Senior Member KDude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AphroditeGoneAwry View Post
    I think the point is to create Heaven on earth inasmuch as that is possible. At least it's a nice goal. The way the Bible holds Heaven up as the pinnacle of Utopia, makes me just think of dangling carrots....for the masses, and is but another example which makes me feel like the early authors/disciples were missing the whole point of God (at times).
    Agreed.

    One of my favorite Christian figures said the same thing. Ended up getting shot for it. His name was Martin Luther King Jr. His ideas, were in turn, inspired by Gandhi.. who was in turn inspired by Leo Tolstoy (yeah, the novelist). Tolstoy wrote a cool book called "The Kingdom of God is Within You" (a quote by Jesus in some versions of the bible), which served as a sort of manifesto for Tolstoy's political and activist ideals.. that creating "heaven" started in the here and now. If you were capable of it.

  5. #185
    failure to thrive AphroditeGoneAwry's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KDude View Post
    Agreed.

    One of my favorite Christian figures said the same thing. Ended up getting shot for it. His name was Martin Luther King Jr. His ideas, were in turn, inspired by Gandhi.. who was in turn inspired by Leo Tolstoy (yeah, the novelist). Tolstoy wrote a cool book called "The Kingdom of God is Within You" (a quote by Jesus in some versions of the bible), which served as a sort of manifesto for Tolstoy's political and activist ideals.. that creating "heaven" started in the here and now. If you were capable of it.
    I will have to get that book. Thanks.
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  6. #186
    royal member Rasofy's Avatar
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    Aprox. 30% of the posts of this thread are Lark's.
    2 theories:
    a) He knows a lot.
    b) He just talks a lot.
    -----------------

    A man builds. A parasite asks 'Where is my share?'
    A man creates. A parasite says, 'What will the neighbors think?'
    A man invents. A parasite says, 'Watch out, or you might tread on the toes of God... '


    -----------------

  7. #187
    LL P. Stewie Beorn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    I hope I dont seem sectarian in saying this but I think within Protestant theology there is a terrible sort of AA style rehabilitative pattern going on, people live a life, they then get on a terrible guilt trip and decide to change their ways, it even goest to the reading of the bible.
    That's probably a legitimate concern where patterns of repentence are distorted. In baptist circles you're practically expected to have a good come to Jesus story where you turned away from the most deplorable of sins. Presbyterians tend to not focus on testimony as much.

    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    God of the old testament seems like a bit of a tyrant, in the new testament he's either a totally different guy or a guy who has undergone the same sort of bizarro change of heart and personality doing just about anything to make amends, including offering his son for sacrifice, like what he once asked of Abraham.
    He's not a tyrant. He's a suzerain king. He swoops down and rescues Adam, Noah, and Abraham and makes covenantal agreements with them which are not based on a mutual exchange, but rather upon the very grace of God.

    The same thing happens in the new testament where Jesus swoops down, dies on the cross, and pays the debts of all the church thus making a covenant with the church based on his grace and not the works of the church.
    Take the weakest thing in you
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  8. #188
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beefeater View Post
    That's probably a legitimate concern where patterns of repentence are distorted. In baptist circles you're practically expected to have a good come to Jesus story where you turned away from the most deplorable of sins. Presbyterians tend to not focus on testimony as much.



    He's not a tyrant. He's a suzerain king. He swoops down and rescues Adam, Noah, and Abraham and makes covenantal agreements with them which are not based on a mutual exchange, but rather upon the very grace of God.

    The same thing happens in the new testament where Jesus swoops down, dies on the cross, and pays the debts of all the church thus making a covenant with the church based on his grace and not the works of the church.
    Here the presbytarians do, here all the protestant churches tend to foster that, some of the RCC congregations foster it too and of course the AA cultural factor influenes and cuts across all the divisions. I dont think its a good thing but I see how it has become a tradition and I see why and how it could from the first principles and precepts you describe and I've read about in Calvin and Luther, I dont believe in their conclusions or the second part of your post.

  9. #189
    LL P. Stewie Beorn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    This was Mark who was asleep at the time?
    The testimony was that it was said a stones throw away from the disciples and that it was at the end of the prayer they were found asleep.

    Do you think mark (and Luke) lied or do you believe people filled in testimony later?
    Take the weakest thing in you
    And then beat the bastards with it
    And always hold on when you get love
    So you can let go when you give it

  10. #190
    Senior Member KDude's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beefeater View Post
    The testimony was that it was said a stones throw away from the disciples and that it was at the end of the prayer they were found asleep.

    Do you think mark (and Luke) lied or do you believe people filled in testimony later?
    The usual theory is that Mark got a lot of his material from Peter's oral storytelling, I think. Mark was a later follower of Peter's, I think? The whole style of the Gospel has the mark of quick, oral storytelling to it as well. It's short, connects a lot of events with "and then.."... "and then". Not much actual teaching or dialogue in it. Most of the gospel plays out like an eyewitness account to actions and events.

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