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  1. #1
    A window to the soul
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    Question Carl Jung: I know God exists...

    I'm confused. Jung said on more than one occasion "I know God exists." From what I can find on the web, the interpretation of Jung's thoughts on God varies from person to person. So I'm wondering if the reason is because Jung's views varied during his lifetime.

    Here's a video taken before Jung's death. Pay attention to context. The interviewer asks Jung about church and then immediately asks Jung if he believes in God. In that context, Jung says he knows God exists. I naturally assumed he's talking about the God of the Bible.


    Is Jung talking about the God of the Bible? Is he talking about intuition?

    Here is a Jung quote, which may have different meaning. I'm not sure. I found it with the vid on the YouTube watch page:

    A young female student accused Jung of being an atheist. Jung was confused and asked the student where she had gotten that idea. The student paraphrased a quote she had read in which Jung said he didn't believe God existed. Jung smiled and said "Dear girl, rest easy, When we have a relationship to a particular thing or experience with it - belief/faith ceases to be a factor. The truth is this, I have had the experience of being gripped by something that is stronger than myself, something that people call God. So, I will never say that I believe that God exists. I must say I know God exists!"

  2. #2
    A window to the soul
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    Default Carl Jung: Death is not the end...



    Interviewer: I know that you say death is psychologically just as important as birth and like it is an integral part of life, but surely, it can't be like birth if it is an end. Can it?

    Jung: Yes. If it is an end and there we are not quite certain about this end because we know that there are these peculiar faculties of the psyche- that it isn't entirely confined to space and time. You can have dreams or visions of the future. You can see around corners and such things. Only igonrants deny these facts. Its quite evident that they do exist and have existed always. Now these facts show that the psyche- in part, at least- is not dependent on these confinements. And then what? When the psyche is not under that obligation to....live in time and space alone- and obviously, it doesn't. Then, in .. to that extent, the psyche is not submitted to those laws and that means a..a practical continuation of life of a sort of psychical existence beyond time and space.

    Interviewer: Do you- yourself believe that death is probably the end or do you believe....

    Jung: Well, I can't say - wissen Sie ? (german translated wold be: you see ?)- the word "believe" is a difficult thing for me. I don't "believe"; I must have a reason for a certain hypothesis. Either I know a thing; and when I KNOW it, I don't need to believe it. If I- I don't allow myself, for instance, to believe a thing just for sake of believing it. I can't believe it! But when there are sufficient reasons for a certain hypothesis, I shall accept these reasons naturally. And to say "We have to recon with the possibility of [so and so]." You know?

    Interviewer: Well...now you told us that we should regard death as being a goal and to stray away from it is to evade life and life's purpose. What advice would you give to people in their later life to enable them to do this when most of them must, in fact, believe that death is the end of everything?

    Jung: Well...you see I have treated many old people and its quite interesting to watch what their conscious doing with the fact that it is apparantly threatened with the complete end. It disregards it. Life behaves as if it were going on and so I think it is better for old people to live on...to look forward to the next day; as if he had to spend centuries and then he lives happily, but when he is afraid and he doesn't looks forward; he looks back. He petrifies. He gets stiff and he dies before his time, but when he's living on, looking forward to the great adventure that is ahead, then he lives. And that is about what your concious is intending to do. Of course it is quite obvious that we're all going to die and this is the sad finale of everything, but never-the-less, there is something in us that doesn't believe it, apparently, but this is merely a fact, a psychological fact. Doesn't mean to me that it proves something. It is simply so. For instance, I may not know why we need salt, but we prefer to eat salt too because we feel better. And so when you think in a certain way, you may feel considerably better. And I think if you think along the lines of nature, then you think properly.

  3. #3
    A window to the soul
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    Lawd, everything suddenly makes sense. [I did some more research.] Jung was a leader in the study of visualization and the unconscious. So Jung was into mysticism, which means he wasn't gripped by God [like he thought], he was gripped by demons; it's doubtful he knew that's what they were. He wrote about his spirit guides where he was first led by a spirit guide called Elijah, which eventually he wrote about changed into an elderly man, Philemon. Jung wrote that Philemon was an external force that had power over his mind. Jung said, "Philemon represented a force which was not myself...it was he who taught me psychic objectivity, the reality of the psyche...there is something in me which can say things that I do not know and do not intend."

    He seriously must have thought his spirit guides were God or God's angels leading him into truth.

    No wonder some people thought he was insane. He wasn't insane at all; I believe he met with an external force just like he said, and he was deceived.

    I think @Victor tried to warn me in a cryptic way and I didn't get it. Now I get it. Victor, please correct me if I'm wrong. Gotta love spiritual hindsight. :\

    Source: http://www.crystalinks.com/jung.html
    Last edited by A window to the soul; 01-28-2012 at 11:17 PM.

  4. #4
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    I've read a lot about Carl Jung's attitude toward religiosity and will continue to, its very interesting but essentially what is to be understood is exactly what you've posted, he considered stating a belief in God to be advancing a hypothesis whereas for him it was fact so he wouldnt say he believed, it is similar to a post I made a while back about what did belief mean when people used the word, is it about existence or is it about confidence in, you can say you believe in your country, sure that isnt simply a statement htat you know your country exists, the same goes for leaders or even partners or friends or family.

    Jung was interested in mysticism but he was also interested in alchemy, estern religions and creedos, he was a genuine eclectic spiritual scholar and travelled to experience all the spiritual shrines and practices first hand, so I wouldnt be surprised if he had experienced something ineffable and gripping in the process. Was it a mere working of the human mind, of his human mind, well really that's a question of the beliefs of whoever is asking because Jung is sure it was not and is on the record being pretty clear about that.

    I would say that when I've immersed myself in Jungs writing abotu this topic and really allowed it to shape my thinking and feeling and meditated upon it I've had dreams and states of mind and mood which probably get as close to a spiritual experience as I've had. The thing about God to Jung is that it is not restricted to the Western monotheistic sense, some how he combined all the concepts of God around the world and through time.

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    Filthy Apes! Kalach's Avatar
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    In Psychology of the Unconscious, Jung goes to some trouble to explain (or at least present) how religious stories are intensely connected to unconscious psychological entities and developments. The stories are at least products of a process where these psychological identifications are built up, rendered into some conscious form and passed along over time to be kept among communities. They retain as much power as they retain psychological truth.

    If this is indeed what Jung was up to in that book and others, then suggesting that Jung was possessed by demons who misled him into prideful identification of godhood with his own psychology is probably to insist that the creation of meaning available to us via normal human process is not real. The religious stories are meaningful not because they express and affirm the existence of deep psychological processes treating of the identity and substance of a people. They are meaningful merely because they are literally true. It becomes a real question then whether psychology as Jung knew it exists at all.

    So it's lucky that God loves us, eh? If She didn't, we'd be nothing but shells.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kalach View Post
    It becomes a real question then whether psychology as Jung knew it exists at all.

    So it's lucky that God loves us, eh? If She didn't, we'd be nothing but shells.
    I think it is lucky that God loves us.

    Anyway, I think that Jung's conceptualisation of the human mind and personality as a sort of constellation in which archetypes and complexes embed is pretty good, his theories of symbols and interpretation likewise, it all prefigures most of the symbolic interactionist and social constructionist thinking which is around today.

    I think his writing about the self is better than some of the contemporary writing about it being imaginary and none existent, only existing in shared narratives of others.

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    From what i have understood from him, he saw god as the person himself and recognized the fact that we dont know everything about the psyche.

    Most people dont know, but jung had a near death experience late in his life. When he died he saw himself outside his body and was lifted to space where(i dont remember exactly how it went from there) he if i remember right he saw his mother and was doing some buddha like thing. Then got pulled back to his body. He was certain that he was meant to die that moment and the doctor who saved him and made him get back to life died shortly after.

    Anyways, his psychology is built largely on studuying different religions and he saw jesus and others as archetypes.

    It should also be noted that he knew quite alot about stuff on tibethan book of the dead. Which basically is explains experiences after death and says that the entities being met are just archetypal products of your psyche and in order to not stay in limbo, you must see them as products of your own psyche, even tho they try to convince you that they are real.
    I think his near death experience just gave some proofs about this hypothesis.

    I actually came to the conclusion that afterlife is just the last moment in your head from looking at different religions and studuying some neuropsychology.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    Jung was interested in mysticism but he was also interested in alchemy
    He wasnt just interested in alchemy, he said that he is alchemist and saw alchemy as sort o the original truth where other religions are originated from.
    "Where wisdom reigns, there is no conflict between thinking and feeling."
    — C.G. Jung

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    Carl Jung was a very silly man.
    A criticism that can be brought against everything ought not to be brought against anything.

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    Senior Member Synapse's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    He seriously must have thought his spirit guides were God or God's angels leading him into truth.

    No wonder some people thought he was insane. He wasn't insane at all; I believe he met with an external force just like he said, and he was deceived.
    lol

    I hope you realise bible's are transmitted in the same manner and they too thought their spirits were God or God's angels leading them into truth and then they translated their views to scripture and mass consciousness agreed with the belief. Instead of understanding they were tapping into ancient egregores and are being deceived.

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