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  1. #21

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    Quote Originally Posted by Viridian View Post
    Brazil. However, being whiter than styrofoam, I do not consider myself Latino. As such, I have many privileges within my country, sociologically speaking.
    Lol. I'm a very white half Mexican myself. I usually pass as white, which results in interesting cultural perspective. I'm realizing we have a lot of Brazilians on this forum. Is it the beach colored layout? :p

    Wait are these examples of cultural appropriation???
    "The purpose of life is to be defeated by greater and greater things." - Rainer Maria Rilke

  2. #22
    Senior Member Viridian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by EffEmDoubleyou View Post
    I think a lot of this is much ado about nothing. When you start making rules about what others can and can't find significant or meaningful, then you get in trouble. Everyone should do their own thing and not worry about what other people are doing. I know this is extremely unpopular, but I also don't think that the aggrieved culture should have the sole power to determine what is offensive.
    But I don't want to possibly be a bad person!

    /earnestly

    Quote Originally Posted by iwakar View Post
    Lol. I'm a very white half Mexican myself. I usually pass as white, which results in interesting cultural perspective. I'm realizing we have a lot of Brazilians on this forum. Is it the beach colored layout? :p

    Wait are these examples of cultural appropriation???
    Lots? I think we have about three of them here, counting me... Though I suppose that's quite a lot compared to other forums? I think?

    Hey now, there's no need to mock me. If you think I'm overreacting, you could just say it...
    Tentative typing: ISFJ 6w5 or 9w1 (Sp/S[?]).

  3. #23

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    Quote Originally Posted by Viridian View Post
    Lots? I think we have about three of them here, counting me... Though I suppose that's quite a lot compared to other forums? I think?

    Hey now, there's no need to mock me. If you think I'm overreacting, you could just say it...
    Lawl, no. I'm not mocking you. But I agree with FM that the concept of aggrievement in this regard is a bit silly.

    And is there really only three forumers? I thought we had more. You folks need to out yourselves! How else will you manage a Brazil Meet-up??? Plus, I need a couch to crash for Carnevale!
    "The purpose of life is to be defeated by greater and greater things." - Rainer Maria Rilke

  4. #24
    Senior Member Viridian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iwakar View Post
    Lawl, no. I'm not mocking you. But I agree with FM that the concept of aggrievement in this regard is a bit silly.
    Ah, OK, thanks. Sorry if I jumped the gun.

    Yes, in this case it was silly, but other examples are more ambiguous - like the Chinese restaurant quandary I mentioned in the OP.

    And is there really only three forumers? I thought we had more. You folks need to out yourselves! How else will you manage a Brazil Meet-up??? Plus, I need a couch to crash for Carnevale!
    Well, there's me, and Rasofy, and Elfa... That's it, I think.

    Meet-ups? But then I'd have to talk! To real people! About the stuff we talk about online! :panic:
    Tentative typing: ISFJ 6w5 or 9w1 (Sp/S[?]).

  5. #25
    Senior Member Beargryllz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Viridian View Post
    I've been reading a few things about the appropriation of elements of other cultures by the dominant ones - usually white American culture - and how it can result in "exoticization" of such non-dominant cultures or use of their symbols without respect or knowledge towards them. For instance, the use of Native American warbonnets/headdresses by white people (outside of the proper ceremonial occasions), as well as dressing up as an "Indian" for Halloween* can be quite offensive to those cultures.

    With that in mind, I do wonder... Considering the way cultures interact, is appropriation part of the whole "coexisting cultures" deal? What is or isn't appropriative? Are "Chinese" restaurants with food adapted for non-Chinese tastes offensive/imperialistic? Where do we draw the line?

    * Look up "Pocahottie". I dare you.
    That article you linked is extremely offensive to me, a white person born in the land my parents call home

    I also find it extremely offensive that a person would deny the cultural significance of entertainment, acting, and children's play

    All of these are essential components of my culture and I would argue with anyone who would want to take these things from me or my people

    I acknowledge wholeheartedly that many Americans, both of Amerindian and European descent, are perpetuating stereotypes, but to speak of the removal or negativity of these components shows a glaring intolerance in itself

    This quote, in particular, makes me laugh uncontrollably

    Well then, Miss Cultural Appropriation Police, what CAN I wear?
    If you choose to wear something Native, buy it from a Native. There are federal laws that protect Native artists and craftspeople who make genuine jewelry, art, etc. (see info here about The Indian Arts and Crafts Act). Anything you buy should have a label that says "Indian made" or "Native made". Talk to the artist. find out where they're from. Be diligent. Don't go out in a full "costume". It's ok to have on some beaded earrings or a turquoise ring, but don't march down the street wearing a feather, with loaded on jewelry, and a ribbon shirt. Ask yourself: if you ran into a Native person, would you feel embarrassed or feel the need to justify yourself? As commenter Bree pointed out, it's ok to own a shirt with kimono sleeves, but you wouldn't go out wearing full kabuki makeup to a bar. Just take a minute to question your sartorial choices before you go out.
    The author should not be taken seriously. It is as simple as that

  6. #26

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    Quote Originally Posted by Viridian View Post
    Yes, in this case it was silly, but other examples are more ambiguous - like the Chinese restaurant quandary I mentioned in the OP.

    How is this an example of cultural appropriation? This is about business strategy. They're adapting to their consumers. They're in it to make money. If they were more concerned with cultural authenticity than making a living, they'd open a museum rather than a restaurant, right?
    "The purpose of life is to be defeated by greater and greater things." - Rainer Maria Rilke

  7. #27

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    Quote Originally Posted by Viridian View Post
    Yes, in this case it was silly, but other examples are more ambiguous - like the Chinese restaurant quandary I mentioned in the OP.
    If our cultural sensitivity is judged by what ingredients we use in orange chicken, society is permanently f@#$&%.
    Everybody have fun tonight. Everybody Wang Chung tonight.

    Johari
    /Nohari

  8. #28
    Senior Member Viridian's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by iwakar View Post
    How is this an example of cultural appropriation? This is about business strategy. They're adapting to their consumers. They're in it to make money. If they were more concerned with cultural authenticity than making a living, they'd open a museum rather than a restaurant, right?
    I kind of understand what you're getting at, but... I think business practices should be held to ethical standards, no? Not that this case in particular is a breach of ethics, but that seems to be what you're implying...

    Quote Originally Posted by EffEmDoubleyou View Post
    If our cultural sensitivity is judged by what ingredients we use in orange chicken, society is permanently f@#$&%.
    Point taken.

    Although there's a lot more to it than just food - there's a mishmash of aesthetic elements from another culture, displayed mostly because they look "exotic", which might be considered fetishization of "the other culture"...

    Also, I still remember something you said in another thread to me... For the very first time, I saw an NT say "Dude, you're overthinking it!". Is this the case now as well?

    Quote Originally Posted by Beargryllz View Post
    That article you linked is extremely offensive to me, a white person born in the land my parents call home
    Well, technically it is usurped land... Not by you in particular, of course, but still...

    I also find it extremely offensive that a person would deny the cultural significance of entertainment, acting, and children's play

    All of these are essential components of my culture and I would argue with anyone who would want to take these things from me or my people

    I acknowledge wholeheartedly that many Americans, both of Amerindian and European descent, are perpetuating stereotypes, but to speak of the removal or negativity of these components shows a glaring intolerance in itself
    I'd say they are concerned with culture, in the sense that they fear that preserving these elements, or not questioning them, might perpetuate bigotry.

    This quote, in particular, makes me laugh uncontrollably



    The author should not be taken seriously. It is as simple as that
    ...What's so strange about that part? I could see a case for other passages, but that one?


    Also, guys, be frank here... Am I being defensive? I don't want to simply fling my own insecurities around instead of engaging in discussion...
    Tentative typing: ISFJ 6w5 or 9w1 (Sp/S[?]).

  9. #29

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    Cultural appropriation is more like a perspective on acculturation than a category of it. The underdog's specifically.
    "The purpose of life is to be defeated by greater and greater things." - Rainer Maria Rilke

  10. #30

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    Quote Originally Posted by Viridian View Post
    Also, guys, be frank here... Am I being defensive? I don't want to simply fling my own insecurities around instead of engaging in discussion...
    I don't think you're being defensive. I just struggle to think of anyone who would not be guilty of cultural insensitivity under your working definition. If everyone is guilty of a crime, you probably need to rewrite that law.

    Yes, you're overthinking it
    Everybody have fun tonight. Everybody Wang Chung tonight.

    Johari
    /Nohari

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