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  1. #71
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kraska View Post
    Have you ever thought that you can belive the reality as it is and at the same time belive in God as well?
    I for example accept the Big bang theory and the evolutionist one and I will belive other theories as well as long as science comes with some decent proof.
    But those theories are no proof against God.
    To be honest the big bang and evolution dont really explain origins despite suggesting they do, properly understood they explain from the point of or from the point after origins.

  2. #72
    Member Kraska's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar View Post
    If denial helps you deal with the harsh realities of life, then power to you.
    Like I said, I can't lie to myself, so it wouldn't work for me.
    So what proof do you have that there is actually nothing after death?
    Because if you call that a reality then you must have some solid proof.

  3. #73
    Member Kraska's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beargryllz View Post
    How is atheism a form of extremism?

    Atheism is the default state for a person
    Atheism in my vision at least means to blindfully belive everything science gives you and denie eveything that opposes it.

  4. #74
    Senior Member King sns's Avatar
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    It's not good or bad, I always view it as a closed mindedness though. There are a lot of things that we can't see as humans with our small scientific eyes. I don't think atheists have their beliefs because it makes them "feel good" -it's just how they think about the topic. The opposite is when people believe in God and go to church just because the idea of possible eternal salvation makes them "feel good." I can fathom that view a little better but feel that it is largely based on fear and prevents open speculation- (just as much as being atheist prevents it.) You have to do mental flip flops to stay within the bounds of your beliefs and still continue to think about it on a completely honest level. I think most every modern person is somewhere in between, though.
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  5. #75
    Occasional Member Evan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kraska View Post
    Atheism in my vision at least means to blindfully belive everything science gives you and denie eveything that opposes it.
    Whoa whoa whoa.. this is not atheism at all, nor does it match scientific convention. Science isn't some authority figure. In fact, the most core assumption of science is "questioning everything is good". That being said, I do take some scientific stances for granted -- I have neither the will nor the ability to work through every proof in every discipline. But you can bet that every 19 year old breaking into a field is trying as hard as he or she can to disprove currently held beliefs. So the beliefs that stand have been questioned by thousands of the greatest minds in every field. And even then, I am tentative about believing what I believe and am open to completely rejecting notions I've taken for granted in the face of new evidence.

    There is nothing blind about science that is not even more blind about religion.

  6. #76
    Nerd King Usurper Edgar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kraska View Post
    So what proof do you have that there is actually nothing after death?
    You cannot prove a negative. I cannot prove to you that there is no afterlife anymore that you can prove to me that there are no unicorns and mermaids.

    Because if you call that a reality then you must have some solid proof.
    Reality is based on proof, not the absence of proof. What I believe to be real is what I can observe with my own eyes or can logically justify.

    The concept of justice in the afterlife as described in major religions seems ludicrous to me. People die (leave their physical bodies) just so they can be punished or rewarded in sensuous ways? How does one feel the burning of hellfire or the sexual pleasures of 72 virgins without a body? And how does one retain memories after death, so they know for what they are being punished? People lose their memories after getting roofied or by falling down a flight of stairs. Dying seems a lot more dramatic. And what is the point punishing or rewarding someone when he doesn't even remember what he did to earn that?
    Listen to me, baby, you got to understand, you're old enough to learn the makings of a man.

  7. #77
    Occasional Member Evan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kraska View Post
    So what proof do you have that there is actually nothing after death?
    Because if you call that a reality then you must have some solid proof.
    Let's turn this around.

    What proof do you have that there is actually something after death? Because if you call that a reality then you must have some solid proof.

    You shouldn't use this argument because it applies equally to your stance. (And in fact, the burden of proof should go to positive claims, not negative ones.)

    Let's all forget about proof for a second and remember Occam's Razor. The simplest explanation consistent with evidence is the best. Since both belief in the afterlife and un-belief in the afterlife are consistent with all the evidence we have, we should default to the simple explanation... which is, when our brains shut down, that's it -- with this belief we don't have to create an entirely new universe to explain how our consciousness is transferred to the non-physical realm, etc.

    I mean, imagine I said "when you die, you turn into an invisible rock on some island in the middle of the Pacific Ocean and maintain your consciousness but you lack the ability to communicate. You can, however, fly around, but if a human instrument could observe an effect you have on the environment, you lose this ability". You'd probably think this was completely crazy, but it's a theory just as consistent with evidence as any other theory regarding the afterlife.

  8. #78
    Senior Member Beargryllz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kraska View Post
    Atheism in my vision at least means to blindfully belive everything science gives you and denie eveything that opposes it.
    Atheism is the lack of a belief in god(s)

    You are making into your own construct while ignoring the meaning. You have invented your own notion of what atheism is, and it is completely separate from atheism.

    Blindfully believing everything science gives you would be a unique belief structure, completely separate from atheism, and it would be worthy of skepticism by anyone, especially an atheist.

  9. #79
    Senior Member Munchies's Avatar
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    Atheist beleive in disbeleif. Hypocrites. Better off admiting you don't know for sure so why can't they just admit they don't know, and not beleive in anything?
    1+1=3 OMFG

  10. #80

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beargryllz View Post
    Atheism is the lack of a belief in god(s)
    Actually, atheism would be the disbelief in god(s), whereas agnosticism is the lack of belief concerning god(s).

    Otherwise, yeah 'n stuff.
    "The purpose of life is to be defeated by greater and greater things." - Rainer Maria Rilke

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