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  1. #171
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    I tend to find that bad religion and good atheism are always contrasted, the worst of one and the best of the other, which is unfair and unrepresentative of reality in any case.

  2. #172
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    The Accelerator

    Quote Originally Posted by entropie View Post
    they gave a noble prize to an aussie for that ? Thought this was made clear already by Einstein and Hawking, who discovered the black hole entropy.
    I think his discovery was that the universe is expanding at an accelerating rate. He expected to find the universe was expanding but didn't expect to find that the expansion is accelerating.

    So the universe has its foot on the accelerator and there appears to be no one at the steering wheel.

    What all this means I don't know. Perhaps we need a new theology. We know the theology of Zeus and Poseidon no longer tells us what it all means. And it seems the theology of Judeo Christianity, Islam, Hinduism, Tribalism and Marxism all seem tired, washed out or strident. What we need is a theology encompassing the acceleration of space.

  3. #173
    resonance entropie's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    I think his discovery was that the universe is expanding at an accelerating rate. He expected to find the universe was expanding but didn't expect to find that the expansion is accelerating.

    So the universe has its foot on the accelerator and there appears to be no one at the steering wheel.

    What all this means I don't know. Perhaps we need a new theology. We know the theology of Zeus and Poseidon no longer tells us what it all means. And it seems the theology of Judeo Christianity, Islam, Hinduism, Tribalism and Marxism all seem tired, washed out or strident. What we need is a theology encompassing the acceleration of space.
    The discovery of the universe is expanding was made by Hubble and Slipher. But people confuse their discovery often: they didnt discover that the whole universe is accelerating away from us but only the majority of the farthest galaxies. The galaxies in our vicinity like Andromeda are actually spectrally shifted to the blue spectrum which means they are moving towards us. You have to factor in as well that the light from the farthest galaxies needs soime billion years to come to us, so when we are looking into deep space, we are actually looking into the past. So how the actual state of the universe is and if its expanding is hard to tell, cause actually we see universe's past. Plus that comes the intresting fact that our nights on Earth and the universe is dark, tho actually they must be lit cause if all the light of the universe would come to us and light travels endlessly, the night must be lit on like a lightbulb. Since it it is not this could mean that the majority of the light hasnt reached us yet.

    If you have the name of the aussie nobel prize winner we could look it up precisely.
    [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEBvftJUwDw&t=0s[/URL]

  4. #174
    Senior Member Munchies's Avatar
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    i think the baffled approach to thinking of there no being god is a feeble characteristic in man, and that relgion was used to manipulate this fact.
    1+1=3 OMFG

  5. #175
    Senior Member Lateralus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Munchies View Post
    i think the baffled approach to thinking of there no being god is a feeble characteristic in man, and that relgion was used to manipulate this fact.
    What?
    "We grow up thinking that beliefs are something to be proud of, but they're really nothing but opinions one refuses to reconsider. Beliefs are easy. The stronger your beliefs are, the less open you are to growth and wisdom, because "strength of belief" is only the intensity with which you resist questioning yourself. As soon as you are proud of a belief, as soon as you think it adds something to who you are, then you've made it a part of your ego."

  6. #176
    Senior Member Munchies's Avatar
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    the normal human response is being baffled at the thought of there being no god. I think Religion is a tool to exploit it.



    What ever happense to wonder? Why can't we admit we're not capable of thunder? So we welcome theyre lies with open arms we turn into succers when theyu turn on their charms
    1+1=3 OMFG

  7. #177
    resonance entropie's Avatar
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    I am rather baffled at the thought of people believing there is a good.
    [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEBvftJUwDw&t=0s[/URL]

  8. #178
    Senior Member reason's Avatar
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    My atheism makes me feel superior to everyone else--well, at least those religious folks. I usually just assume that everyone else is religious and I am the only voice of reason left in an irrational world. It's like the media outlets that I enjoy exist only for me, and everyone else just watches Fox News. I know it's stupid to suppose hundreds of thousands of copies of Richard Dawkins's The God Delusion were published just so one might end up in my hands, but it really feels like that's what happened. I'm the only one, or one of few, actually, and therefore special.

    What I really like to do is try to convince other people that they're wrong by calling them idiots; I find that tactic works very well. It doesn't change their minds, but their defensive and dogmatic response just confirm how much smarter I am--that's what it's all about, really. You see, I have reason, rationality, logic, science, and sociology on my side. I may not really know what the word 'valid' means, but I know that theism is invalid like a teapot. I tacitly accept some naive form of empiricism, because I find that to be a useful stick to hit theists with. I don't really understand it, truth be told -- some technical stuff to do with hypotheses, evidence, and probability. It doesn't matter, because smart people somewhere understand it and they tell me that's it's true. What's more important it that most theists can't argue on that level anyway, so whatever the case, they end up looking stupid.

    Anyway, I'm really fired up about being an atheist. Good stuff. Shout out to the all pastafarians ... W00t!
    A criticism that can be brought against everything ought not to be brought against anything.

  9. #179
    darkened dreams labyrinthine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    I tend to find that bad religion and good atheism are always contrasted, the worst of one and the best of the other, which is unfair and unrepresentative of reality in any case.
    I've seen that happen, but I've also noticed that whether it is religion or politics, people's perceptions are naturally skewed to singling out those events and statements that are dismissive, rejecting, or even threatening to their position. In politics conservatives feel like the news media and the whole world is out of control liberal (or some more modified versions of it) while liberals feel that conservationism (at least in the U.S.) has gone to the extreme right flooding most of the media. Christians feel a loss of power when "Merry Christmas" and nativity scenes are removed from public places while their numbers remain in the vast majority. Atheists feel persecuted when when statistics show that for "least desirable belief system to have your daughter marry into" places them below nearly all religions.

    Having switched perspectives I remember feeling oppression from atheists for having theist beliefs and being made fun of -mostly in academia or online. My major professor at university made me feel quite embarrassed and stupid for composing a piece about the flood, but I never understood why because so often the atheist position can be to take superiority and revel in the "stupidity" of others. In many settings I had to be careful not to be too open about my specific religion and its requirements. Ironically enough, now that I am an atheist/agnostic I feel like I wouldn't dare be public about it because of the detriment to my career which is peripherally steeped in religion. The consequences for the few things I've shared with people close to me have been pretty hurtful. It's not that great socially on either side because what people still need to learn is tolerance.

    I think in a way every group faces alienation and even persecution in certain contexts and power in others. We become more keenly aware of the former and so the overall assumptions of people is inclined towards feeling entitled to have more power. it is really a complex issue and it is not equal for all - there are dominant, privileged groups, and underrepresented, misunderstood, and oppressed groups, but for some reason people in general feel their entitlements for power and respect are not yet met.

    edit: Statistics for atheism in the U.S. 85% adults are Christians, 12% of adults are atheist/agnostic.
    Step into my metaphysical room of mirrors.
    Fear of reality creates myopic morality
    So I guess it means there is trouble until the robins come
    (from Blue Velvet)

  10. #180
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by entropie View Post
    The discovery of the universe is expanding was made by Hubble and Slipher. But people confuse their discovery often: they didnt discover that the whole universe is accelerating away from us but only the majority of the farthest galaxies. The galaxies in our vicinity like Andromeda are actually spectrally shifted to the blue spectrum which means they are moving towards us. You have to factor in as well that the light from the farthest galaxies needs soime billion years to come to us, so when we are looking into deep space, we are actually looking into the past. So how the actual state of the universe is and if its expanding is hard to tell, cause actually we see universe's past. Plus that comes the intresting fact that our nights on Earth and the universe is dark, tho actually they must be lit cause if all the light of the universe would come to us and light travels endlessly, the night must be lit on like a lightbulb. Since it it is not this could mean that the majority of the light hasnt reached us yet.

    If you have the name of the aussie nobel prize winner we could look it up precisely.
    The Nobel Prize in Physics 2011 was divided, one half awarded to Saul Perlmutter, the other half jointly to Brian P. Schmidt and Adam G. Riess "for the discovery of the accelerating expansion of the Universe through observations of distant supernovae".

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