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  1. #51
    XES 5231311252's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by freeeekyyy View Post
    It's commonly accepted that humans are different from/more valuable than other animals. But why is that? What is it about humanity that makes us any better or of any greater worth? Why do animals not have the same rights as people? I have my own ideas about this and my own reasons, but I want to know what you all think first. Are we better than animals, and if so, why?
    The biggest thing that separates humans from animals is power and I'd have to say that humans in general are worse than animals. I recently viewed some of the sickest shit I never thought, never even had an inkling of something like it ever existing and it involved a human exerting it's power over an animal.
    “'Fuck', I think. What a beautiful word. If I could say only one thing for the rest of my life, that would be it.”

  2. #52
    meh Salomé's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spurgeon View Post
    According to Lenore Thomson (author of Personality Type: An Owner's Manual), Introverted Feeling is what separates us from other animals.

    I swear I'm not making it up!

    I will find the quote when I get home.
    LOL. That's awesome. Does that mean Te-doms are sub-human?
    No argument from me.

    Also, that must mean that grey whales are more human than humans, since they have 3 times more "empathy cells" than we do.
    Quote Originally Posted by Ivy View Post
    Gosh, the world looks so small from up here on my high horse of menstruation.

  3. #53
    Ghost Monkey Soul Vizconde's Avatar
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    Some humans can ride unicycles
    I redact everything I have written or will write on this forum prior to, subsequent with and or after the fact of its writing. For entertainment purposes only and not to be taken seriously nor literally.

    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar View Post
    Spamtar - a strange combination of boorish drunkeness and erudite discussions, or what I call "an Irish academic"

  4. #54
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evan View Post
    What I meant was, I thought it was obvious I meant context-free perspective, and you argued as if I meant non-human perspective.
    Ohhhhhh, I gotcha.

    Ok, I missed that the first time I went back and read what you wrote.

    The second time, I saw the ambiguity of that word (i.e., outside), and thought it might be the problem.

    I really was just arguing against the "outside" terminology: I mean, in the end, there's no such thing as a context-free perspective.

    (There is, however, the possibility that one may have the right context so that one may "objectively" evaluate a particular situation.)

    Quote Originally Posted by Evan View Post
    Perhaps. I must be honest, though -- I can't even hold the premise (that there is a God) in my head long enough to comment on the matter.
    Interesting...

    Not to imply that there's anything necessarily wrong with that, but, why do you think that is?

  5. #55
    Occasional Member Evan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    (There is, however, the possibility that one may have the right context so that one may "objectively" evaluate a particular situation.)
    I agree. Saying true things is totally possible, we just can't "objectively" confirm their truth.

    Interesting...

    Not to imply that there's anything necessarily wrong with that, but, why do you think that is?
    I just can't picture a perspective that isn't biased, because perspective seems biased by definition. I guess maybe that's irrelevant in this case, though. We could define God's perspective as the perspective in which the bias points exactly at the truth. But then that seems trivial... iono. I didn't really think it through.

  6. #56
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evan View Post
    I agree. Saying true things is totally possible, we just can't "objectively" confirm their truth.
    Yup.

    I think that was #3 of my things to keep in mind: inevitable uncertainty.

    Quote Originally Posted by Evan View Post
    I just can't picture a perspective that isn't biased, because perspective seems biased by definition. I guess maybe that's irrelevant in this case, though. We could define God's perspective as the perspective in which the bias points exactly at the truth. But then that seems trivial... iono. I didn't really think it through.
    Oh, I was talking about the existence of God...

    I thought you said you couldn't hold the premise that God might exist in your head for a very long time...

  7. #57
    Occasional Member Evan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    I thought you said you couldn't hold the premise that God might exist in your head for a very long time...
    Well I can't, but I think that has more to do with the fact that I never know how people are defining God. It just seems like a nonsense term to me. The only way I can make sense of it is to define it as equivalent to something I actually understand. Like if someone were to say God is the laws of physics, that would make perfect sense to me. Or if they said God is the perspective that is true, I guess that's fine. I just don't generally understand how the concept is useful or descriptive at all.

  8. #58
    Senior Member Spurgeon's Avatar
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    Ok, after reading it again, it seems that I slightly misrepresented what Lenore Thomson said about this.

    Here is the quote.

    From Personality Type: An Owner's Manual:

    This is precisely what Introverted Feeling does: it bypasses structural considerations and puts human value first. Such discrimination is unquestionably illogical, but it's in no way irrational. Indeed, to place human value above statistical risk isn't possible without the ability to reason.
    One might even suggest that it's the rational character of Introverted Judgement that separates us from the species who share most of our DNA. Our closest primate relatives can be observed to use Extraverted Judging skills. they recognize a hierarchy of relationships, react to social cues, sacrifice their options for a wounded mate or an infant. They can be taught to perform calculations, to manipulate signs, to abstract general concepts. but they can't be taught to defy statistical odds purely for the sake of human value.
    So, if I'm understanding her correctly, she's suggesting that Introverted Judgement (Fi or Ti) may be what separates us from our closest primate relatives.

    If that's true, the implications are interesting, if not hilarious (on so many levels!)

    Quote Originally Posted by Salomé View Post
    LOL. That's awesome. Does that mean Te-doms are sub-human?
    No argument from me.
    Yeah, and Fe-doms as well, apparently.

    I don't really believe that, of course, but it sure is a funny thought!

  9. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evan View Post
    Well I can't, but I think that has more to do with the fact that I never know how people are defining God. It just seems like a nonsense term to me. The only way I can make sense of it is to define it as equivalent to something I actually understand. Like if someone were to say God is the laws of physics, that would make perfect sense to me. Or if they said God is the perspective that is true, I guess that's fine. I just don't generally understand how the concept is useful or descriptive at all.
    Wow...

    So you have a hard time actually imagining what a God would be like?

  10. #60
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spurgeon View Post
    <wink at Zara>
    Yeah, I'd considered what you'd said for the last week or so, and I never really could agree with it.

    You'll see in this post (LINK) that I spend a lot of time with a dog who I would swear is an Fi-dom, so...

    I think the more likely truth is that animals tend to be Ss and Fs, and that we developed iNtuition and Thinking as we evolved.

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