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  1. #81
    Anew Leaf
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    hey Zara

    I haven't been on much this week. When I get a chance I will peruse what you have posted and write a reply worthy of your time investment.


  2. #82
    Anew Leaf
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    Ok, Zara, Sorry for the delay. I had to take a forum break for some stuff.

    Question: What is your source for these descriptions?

    Here is my initial response:

    Mercury Conjunction Venus 4.38 293

    She looks on the bright side of life: she is gay, agreeable, optimistic, sociable. She likes to speak and write, and does both with charm and artistry. Her intellectual pleasures are influenced by her feelings. She is amorous and sensual. She likes beauty, the Arts but also travelling.
    Ok, I can buy this for the most part. Although it does sound hilariously ENFP .

    Sun Conjunction Mercury 5.32 225

    Because your ego and your mind are aligned, you possess much mental energy. You are always in a position to think about what you want, and in many ways, this is an interruption of the will. You are highly intelligent with a great drive to communicate with other. You invest a lot of pride in your intellectual capacities. You may not always listen as well as you speak, however! You might be too busy thinking about what to say next. But you are very curious and although you enjoy expressing yourself, you usually don't dominate conversations completely. As far as studying or learning goes, you are better off reading the material than listening to a teacher. These traits come from a strong need to take an active role in communications. It is very hard for you to passively listen and absorb information.

    Your opinions are usually strong and you are an independent thinker. You tend to be proud of your opinions and thoughts, and might easily get a bruised ego if you are not "heard", if your opinions are pushed aside or ignored, or if your opinions are criticized. You are expressive and possibly a very animated speaker. You are also very witty and others enjoy your playful and sometimes mischievous sense of humor.
    This sounds like me as well, and also very ENFP. I have my Italian heritage to thank for being an animated (complete with gesticulating hands) speaker.

    Moon Sextile Venus 1.36 174

    You are generally amiable and project a soft and yielding manner. You possess natural charm and you are highly imaginative and sympathetic. You can make an excellent mediator and go-between. You are keenly aware of your need for relationships and for intimacy. You have a well-developed respect for qualities typically associated with the feminine. People appreciate you for your tender heart and friendly, diplomatic disposition. You should enjoy a good measure of personal popularity and success in your life. Although generally considered "lucky" with relationships and with money, this is less about luck than it is about a certain level of inner peace and positive energy that attracts pleasant situations. At times you can be complacent, downright lazy, and over-indulgent in the "pleasures" of life. However, you are a peace-maker at heart and have an unusual ability to help and heal others. You are gracious and warm.
    @underline, I laugh because my motto in life is "I hate people."
    @bold, I laugh because this is hilariously not the case.
    Sun Opposition Midheaven 3.42 -118

    She struggles with finding a career that suits the personality. She does not face up to problems and her plans are often difficult or even impossible for her to realize
    This sounds like the casting call of every INFP... nay, every NP .

    Moon Opposition Mars 0.33 -99

    You can be precocious, animated, and passionate. You seek emotional excitement in your life. Although you often project a brave and tough image, your skin isn't as thick as you'd have others believe. You tend to put up defenses due to your emotionally vulnerable and excitable disposition. Unrest is characteristic, as you are bored by routine and become easily frustrated when life is "too easy". There's a buzz of energy surrounding you, and you tend to meet with many conflicts in your life. With the opposition, the conflict tends to be lived through relationships. The passions are quite raw, especially in youth.

    If you can channel your excitable energy into sports or some other competitive field, all the better. Although you can be a decidedly amiable and interesting person, others always seem to sense your boundaries. Something is bound to get you worked up, and it's not always clear what that something will be. Your bluntness can be both appreciated and considered offensive, depending on your audience! You are eager to make a personal impact on those around you. It is possible that you are too eager in this sense, and you come across as self-absorbed and difficult to stomach. Patience is definitely not your strong point! Your responses are quick, and your are a passionate person who is usually quite courageous although your energy is sporadic and sometimes wasted. You are sexually responsive.

    Short description: She is very emotional and is driven to do things by her emotions. She does not think things over or through in a given situation. She is irascible and easily angered or fired up. Marital disputes are very likely, and a heated domestic atmosphere.
    @Bold, I like how random this paragraph is. You like talking with people and are couragous. Oh, and you are a lady in the kitchen and a whore in the bedroom.
    @underline 1, I don't see this at all. I am pretty good at making conversations about other people and not myself.
    @underline 2: yes, I am emotional and they drive me for the most part. But I don't get angry easily. In relationships, I don't get angry easily either. And when I do, it is extremely rare for me to raise my voice.

    Sun Trine Uranus 2.00 97

    It is natural for you to question tradition. You are, above all things, an individualist. You naturally rebel against that which is established. It doesn't mean that you consistently break all the rules, but you definitely do question some of the rules, especially those that simply don't make much sense. You possess a huge distaste for routine. You work best when you have some say as to when and how you get things done. You possess much self-integrity. You avoid labeling people and are most offended when others attempt to label or stereotype you.

    You easily embrace new ways of doing things, you stick up for the underdog, and you express yourself in unique and inspiring ways. You don't have to try to stand out as unique--you are original, creative, and progressive without trying. You are far from pretentious. You value honesty and truth, and you avoid putting on airs. You believe in the equality of people, and easily relate to people from all walks of life. You possess an unmistakable enthusiasm about life, and generally your life is interesting because you invite unusual or adventurous experiences into your life. You are generally appreciated by others because you are open-minded, fair, and not judgmental. Nothing really seems to faze you! You take things in stride, and are rarely shocked or taken aback by human behavior.
    I can buy most of this paragraph as well.

    upiter Sextile Saturn 0.35 75

    She is serious, patient, honest, hard-working, orderly. Her judgment is good and she thinks things over. She pursues her objectives to the bitter end, usually knowing when to choose the right moment. She is upright and respects the law.
    Eh, not so much here. Just a few aspects above it said I wasn't patient. Which is it? I don't even understand the part about the objectives. I am actually quite bad at persuing things. I respect the law because I don't want to be someone's bitch in jail.

    Venus Square Jupiter 1.52 -75

    She is nonchalant, pretentious, full of self-importance. She likes what is beautiful and sometimes ostentatious, and spends lots of money for the sake of appearances. She likes to please and has numerous amorous adventures. She is unfaithful and undergoes tribulations in love.
    Yeah, a giant fat NO to all of this except I do like beauty, but... most people do.

    Venus Trine Mars 2.09 62

    She is amorous, not a peaceful and calm lover but a passionate one with a strong temperament. She is demonstrative in love, and likes healthy pleasures. She enjoys life to the full.
    No comment.

    Mercury Square Neptune 1.36 -51

    She makes errors of judgement, and lacks sincerity. She lets things happen, and is happy in her dreamworld. Confronted by reality, she is hesitant, incapable of being tested and falls back into her imaginary world. She might become a drug-taker.
    A few years ago, this sounds more like me in regards to a dreamworld. Now, not so much. I think reality has Confronted me and we married.

    Mercury Trine Uranus 3.32 43

    She is perspicacious, ingenious: she binds intelligence and originality together with genius. She likes literature, especially fiction. She is spontaneous in her friendships and knows how to take advantage of the situations that arise.
    I giggled at Uranus. Um, oh right, serious face time. *frowns* Sounds like me.

    Moon Sextile Mercury 3.02 41

    You can be quite expressive and animated in your speech. You have an outstanding memory and tend to pick up a lot of information from your environment. You love to chat and to exchange ideas. Even if you are shy, once you're friends, you love to talk about pretty much anything under the sun, and you enjoy sharing stories from your past! For the most part, you are focused on day-to-day activities in your communications rather than on grander philosophies. You are naturally curious and interested, and others find you very easy to talk to. You are accommodating and curious, but you are not as well equipped to handle heavy emotional demands. You thrive on change and variety. You might be a little addicted to gossip! More probably, however, you are simply very curious about others. There is a twinkle in your eyes, and you are never short on humor. You are playful and versatile--you make a fun companion and an interesting friend. You listen! Yes, you do talk and occasionally interrupt in your excitement, but you are a curious person who does want to hear what others have to say, and that is a real pleasure. In fact, you are more able than most people to get others talking, simply because you are very receptive and sympathetic. You pick up others' feelings and body language readily.
    @bold 1: vice versa
    @bold 2: i like emotions in others unless i don't like that person and then i want them to take their emotions and ship them off to patagonia. unless by heavy emotional demands this means Fe aux and doms. then it's true.
    @bold 3: i find gossip boring
    @underline: only if people are interesting. and very few are.

    Sun Square Neptune 3.57 -41

    You have a desire to be something special or to experience something more than the ordinary. You are a day-dreamer and idealist. It is easy for you to trust others, even (and perhaps especially) people who might seem from the outside looking in as unsavory types. You are looking to identify with something beyond what is normally expected of people. You may have had a childhood that didn't help you direct or define your life. Perhaps the early family life was lacking in supervision or clearly defined rules. A father figure may have been absent or distant and ineffective. You may have a glorified image of your father. Whether the image is very positive or very negative (or if it swings between these extremes), the image is not very clear or rational. Whatever the case may be, you struggle with defining who you are. You might gravitate towards the "wrong people", or get in with the "wrong crowd" in an attempt to define who you are. You might be susceptible to being taken advantage of by others, especially by men or authority figures. You may be easily led astray by peculiar desires or self-destructive habits. In order to add a greater-than-ordinary dimension of experience to your life that helps you to feel special and important, you might be attracted to Neptune-ruled behaviors, such as secret affairs, drugs, or other escapist behaviors. In some way, you may feel a strong urge to glamorize your role in the world. There can be some confusion about the past (such as remembering childhood experiences in ways that are far removed from reality), and a tendency to daydream about being someone more "important" than you feel you are. You may struggle with early conditioning that made you feel tossed aside or neglected in some way, and certainly not directed or supported. You are very sensitive, especially with regards to any real or imagined blows to your ego. If the natal chart shows a strong sense of reality and a robust mind (Mercury and Saturn well-placed, for example), the negative interpretations of this aspect are less extreme. Still, you are likely to recognize at some point in your life that you have a tendency to engage in escapist and self-destructive fantasies and/or habits. It is useful to be able to connect these behaviors with their probable source, which is likely to be a weakly-defined ego and identity in childhood.
    @bold1: No, my dad may have been INTP, but I was an only child and he was pretty involved in my life.
    @bold2: No, I don't.
    @bold 3: Never done drugs... because i am lazy, lol. i have enough trouble putting energy into a relationship with someone. adding an affair to the mix just seems rather... pointless and annoying. also dramatic.
    @underline: outside of wanting to write some ridiculously famous novel so that i can use that money to buy my own island and get away from people... not really
    @bold: nope.

    this last paragraph was kind of weird and full of too many "maybe this or that or this or that."

    Overall, I find this very interesting Zara. I appreciate your time and effort into this. I still don't believe in this system as an accurate portrayal of who I am, but I enjoy hearing about it.

    Neff Pea 2u.

  3. #83
    Occasional Member Evan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    I am NOT saying that's ALL astrology is: I'm saying that its representational truth is scientifically unverifiable and unfalsifiable.

    As such, the only rational position is to be agnostic on the matter.
    I strongly disagree with this reasoning.

  4. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evan View Post
    I strongly disagree with this reasoning.
    Yes, most people don't understand this truth yet.

    Feel free to critique my reasoning.

    I'll show you why you're wrong.

  5. #85
    Occasional Member Evan's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    Yes, most people don't understand this truth yet.

    Feel free to critique my reasoning.

    I'll show you why you're wrong.
    Just because a possibility is consistent with ALL data doesn't mean you should have no comment on the truth value.

    It's like the flying spaghetti monster argument. Are you agnostic about the flying spaghetti monster?

  6. #86
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evan View Post
    Just because a possibility is consistent with ALL data doesn't mean you should have no comment on the truth value.
    Could you expand on this a bit.

    Quote Originally Posted by Evan View Post
    It's like the flying spaghetti monster argument. Are you agnostic about the flying spaghetti monster?
    No.

    I am agnostic however about whether there is a God.

    As I am agnostic about whether we live in an inherently meaningful universe (i.e., meaning outside of what we give to it).

    As I am agnostic about whether astrology is representationally true.

    And I see all three of these as being highly related ideas.

    I do not see the Flying Spaghetti Monster as a highly related idea, though.

    I know that it was an intentional creation to try and prove a point.

  7. #87

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    What type of agnosticism are we talking about here? Is it possible to be agnostic about a particular issue, but at the same time think it is a waste of time to think about it too much? Because that is the position I have regarding the flying spaghetti monster, astrology, and many other un-testable ideas.

    I generally only think about such things in passing, but when the topic turns to "the only rational position is agnosticism" my interest increases. In a way, I agree with you. Statements that are un-testable have no way of being proven true, and no way of being proven false. So agnosticism seems natural. However, my agnosticism is also accompanied by the attitude that "there are more valuable ideas to ponder."

    Accept the past. Live for the present. Look forward to the future.
    Robot Fusion
    "As our island of knowledge grows, so does the shore of our ignorance." John Wheeler
    "[A] scientist looking at nonscientific problems is just as dumb as the next guy." Richard Feynman
    "[P]etabytes of [] data is not the same thing as understanding emergent mechanisms and structures." Jim Crutchfield

  8. #88
    Riva
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    I believe in Astrology (Indian version of it).
    This being said I should mention that I am south Asian, so I am heavily influenced by it.

    Indian Astrology is so very complicated and differs from the Western one.
    And it is old, very very old.
    Older than Buddhism by many a thousand years.

    Prince King Śuddhodana consulted astrologers when his son was born.
    His son's name was Prince Siddhartha (Also known as Buddha.)
    (Which was and is done to this by Hindus and Buddhist when a child is born.)

    500 astrologers there were, of which 499 said that he would either become a great emperor or
    leave the inheritance to the throne and find the path to total liberation (Nirvana).
    1 Said he would definitely find the path to total liberation.

    King Śuddhodana tried to prevent his son from leaving the kingdom and becoming a hermit searching for Nirvana.
    Gave his son everything he needed. (The king he was and gave him palaces, food, luxury and women.)
    (A harem I believe.)

    His son still left, ran away infact.
    (INFJ he must have been.)
    Attained Nirvana 6 years later.

    So that one astrologer was correct.
    But Buddha discouraged the people who listened to him from following astrology.
    He warned them of the bad influences Astrology sometimes brings.

    But the followers 2600 years later still follows astrology despite Buddha's warning.

  9. #89
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    A professor of religious studies taught me that Buddha was not a prince but simply the son of a 'noble' family.

  10. #90
    Riva
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nicodemus View Post
    A professor of religious studies taught me that Buddha was not a prince but simply the son of a 'noble' family.
    It is his opinion.
    What matters is that he was not a son of a king but that he taught the four noble truths.

    His father was the leader of the Shakya people.
    It could be interpreted as King or maybe a noble family.

    Ps -
    What proof did he give to support this?
    I am interested as to how he arrived at this.


    Edit -
    His father was the leader of the Shakya people.
    It could be interpreted as King or maybe a noble family.

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