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  1. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spurgeon View Post
    Zarathustra: Tell me your definition of existentialism, and I will tell you how it conflicts with Biblical Christianity.
    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    What do I look like, an NTP?
    Quote Originally Posted by KDude View Post
    [To Spurgeon] Lol.. You need to start participating. Somehow. Every post of yours lately comes off like some kneejerk reaction and defense of some "truth" that you've yet to actually defend or even state, for that matter. It's like you disagree, but want others to make your points for you.
    Quote Originally Posted by Spurgeon View Post
    I'm not sure it's worth the time.
    Quote Originally Posted by KDude View Post
    Why would you think that, if I'm asking you?

    And since when do I have to twist an ENTP's arm to argue something? If there's anything that's a waste of time, it's that. I shouldn't even have to do it.
    Quote Originally Posted by Spurgeon View Post
    Considering that I have a wife and kids, a job, and other responsibilities--This is just not very high on my list of priorities.

    I wish I had more time to participate, but I simply don't.
    Quote Originally Posted by KDude View Post
    Fair enough then.
    And, on that note, I just want to say that I think all NTPs should be forced to study the development of Wittgenstein's thought from his earlier writings (The Tractatus Logico-Philosophicus) to his later writings (The Philosophical Investigations, On Certainty, et al).

  2. #112
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    Falsifiability

    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    And what of the things that the scientific method cannot tell us?
    The scientific method is a way of testing guesses to see if they are false. It's called falsifiability.

    We have been able to falsify the Exodus and the Mormon history of North and Cental America, because both made claims that could be falsified by archeology.

    However claims that can't be falsified, such as the existence of a benevolent God, can't be tested by the scientific method.

  3. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spurgeon View Post
    This is the worst mis-interpretation of Scripture I have ever seen in my life.
    There are more than a thousand christian sects, each with their own interpretation of scripture. And each thinks their interpretation of scripture is right. And they think the other sects have mis-interpreted scripture.

  4. #114
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    Lightbulb Getting Somewhere

    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    The scientific method is a way of testing guesses to see if they are false. It's called falsifiability.

    We have been able to falsify the Exodus and the Mormon history of North and Cental America, because both made claims that could be falsified by archeology.

    However claims that can't be falsified, such as the existence of a benevolent God, can't be tested by the scientific method.
    Yes, I know this.

    My question was: what of all the things that are not falsifiable?

  5. #115
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    I am so confused! /:

    Quote Originally Posted by Spurgeon View Post
    Ok, fair enough. It was a bit of an exaggeration.

    But you clearly don't understand what you're talking about. There are so many problems with your interpretation, I honestly don't know where to begin.
    I think you like to argue. (So do I.)

    Quote Originally Posted by KDude View Post
    Keirkegaard was a Christian by any typical, Protestant, credal standard of the label. He believed Jesus was the son of God, that he rose from the dead, etc.. What more do you want from the guy? To reflect every single facet of the world contained in the Bible, as you see it? Is that what Christianity is? Since when? And why?
    I'm tending to agree with you. We are saved by grace through faith in Jesus. And not through a perfect interpretation of the Bible. Forgive me if I've gone off topic. I'm completely lost.

    Quote Originally Posted by KDude View Post
    And am I going to hell because I like Apple Pie then? Because unfortunately, Jesus didn't give me any rules about it. And it's not something mentioned in Chronicles of the Kings of Israel. Jedediah begat Zephariah, instead of Apple Pie. And now I'm an abomination in the eyes of the Lord. Amen.
    Gosh, no!

    Quote Originally Posted by Spurgeon View Post
    That is all completely irrelevant.
    What are you arguing about, lol?

    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    And, on that note, I just want to say that I think all NTPs should be forced to study the development of Wittgenstein's thought from his earlier writings (The Tractatus Logico-Philosophicus) to his later writings (The Philosophical Investigations, On Certainty, et al).
    LoLz!

  6. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nerd Girl View Post
    LoLz!

  7. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    Yes, I know all this.

    My question was: what of all the questions that are unfalsifiable?
    Well, my guess is that unfalsifiable claims are ones that do not allow evidence to be gathered.

    String Theory does not allow evidence to be gathered, and so is unfalsifiable, even though String Theory elegantly unites Quantum Mechanics and General Relativity.

    Also experiences that are unrepeatable also seem to me to be unfalsifiable. For to gather evidence, everyone needs to be able to gather the same evidence. For instance to gather evidence of the size and charge of the electron, all of us need to gather the same evidence and apply the same reason to the evidence. So personal annecdotal experiences, not available to everyone, seem to me to be unfalsifiable.

  8. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    Well, my guess is that unfalsifiable claims are ones that do not allow evidence to be gathered.

    String Theory does not allow evidence to be gathered, and so is unfalsifiable, even though String Theory elegantly unites Quantum Mechanics and General Relativity.

    Also experiences that are unrepeatable also seem to me to be unfalsifiable. For to gather evidence, everyone needs to be able to gather the same evidence. For instance to gather evidence of the size and charge of the electron, all of us need to gather the same evidence and apply the same reason to the evidence. So personal annecdotal experiences, not available to everyone, seem to me to be unfalsifiable.
    Yes, those are both examples (one specific, one general) of things that would seem to fall into the realm of unfalsifiability. I think there are many more, too. You mentioned the one about whether there is a benevolent God. The benevolence wouldn't seem to necessarily be required, but all kinds of cosmological questions would seem to fall outside the realm of falsifiability.

    Still, though (and I say this with all respect, as I appreciate that you're finally seeming to engage with me openly and honestly): you have not answered my question. While the scientific method would seem to be able to help us better understand the issues that are falsifiable, what about the ones that are not?

    I ask because my impression has been that you do not regard these questions with much respect or importance.

    And this has always been an issue for me with your perspective on things.

  9. #119
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    Piety and Taboo

    Quote Originally Posted by Zarathustra View Post
    Yes, those are both examples (one specific, one general) of things that would seem to fall into the realm of unfalsifiability. I think there are many more, too. You mentioned the one about whether there is a benevolent God. The benevolence wouldn't seem to necessarily be required, but all kinds of cosmological questions would seem to fall outside the realm of falsifiability.

    Still, though (and I say this with all respect, as I appreciate that you're finally seeming to engage with me openly and honestly): you have not answered my question. While the scientific method would seem to be able to help us better understand the issues that are falsifiable, what about the ones that are not?

    I ask because my impression has been that you do not regard these questions with much respect or importance.

    And this has always been an issue for me with your perspective on things.
    My last taboo was piety. And so I am inclined to revel in my impiety.

    So I am impius towards MBTI and naturally towards faith.

    I do understand my impiety is a scandal for the pius. And that breaking the last taboo disconcerts believers and perhaps even caused disgust and anger.

    But I love my freedom from piety - I can dance where I like - an impius imp, free, free at last.

  10. #120
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    ^Victor~


    You make the most beautiful Möbii.

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    The more one loves God, the more it is that having nothing in the world means everything, and the less one loves God, the more it is that having everything in the world means nothing.

    Do not resist an evil person, but to him who strikes you on the one cheek, offer also the other. ~Matthew 5:39

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