Victor's thoughts on makeup

[rav3n]

I already said multiple times that Victor seems to have fear and/or anger towards women. I knew this one day when he started talking about Sylvia Plath and compared me to her, and from a very strange angle, which made me angry.

However, his point is more than simply women shouldn't wear make-up...all the stuff he said about brands, et al, is exactly what nebbykoo and shortnsweet said...it's all, again, part of his mission for authenticity.

If Victor believes in authenticity, then why does he hide behind ambiguous language? Is his metaphoric style not a form of branding and mask?

 

[rav3n]

Because he's in an Fi/Ni loop tenaciously rejecting his Se. That's the typology explanation.

So everyone must pander to his loopiness?

 

[Tiltyred]

So you like him because he reminds you of yourself as a teenage girl. That's about where I assess the quality of reasoning and expression, too. So at least we agree that far.

He has no mission for authenticity. He makes stuff up out of thin air or steals it from other writers and gives them no credit. What mission for authenticity?

 

[Salomé]

If Victor believes in authenticity, then why does he hide behind ambiguous language? Is his metaphoric style not a form of branding and mask?

ESTJ much?

 

[Randomnity]

If you speak vaguely enough, all sorts of people will think you're a genius, apparently. After all, just think of all the brilliant things you didn't say, but can be read into your words by overactive N because hey, your words don't rule them out!

 

[Thalassa]

He has no mission for authenticity. He makes stuff up out of thin air or steals it from other writers and gives them no credit. What mission for authenticity?

I don't agree with that. There's a common theme in his posts, his morals are pretty damn firm and consistent and dom Fi. He doesn't just make stuff up out of thin air.

 

[Tiltyred]

I'm sorry, but he does.

 

[gromit]

Victor is an enigma wrapped inside a... how does it go?

 

[rav3n]

If you speak vaguely enough, all sorts of people will think you're a genius, apparently. After all, just think of all the brilliant things you didn't say, but can be read into your words by overactive N because hey, your words don't rule them out!

The Internet is a global tribe where each website is a village. Within the village are the tribal elders who chant their visions of the societal construct that all members of the village must live by. These visions include stories passed down from generation to generation from other wisdom collecting shaman.

Or some such!

 

[Thalassa]

I'm sorry, but he does.

I think that's your perception of it.

I could pretty easily name off right now what Victor feels strongly about. If by making things up out of thin air, you mean he has an imagination and he infers things about other people's motives, then sure he does that...but that's not like pulling stuff out of his ass just to troll. That's more like something ...other members...would do.

 

[Salomé]

After all, just think of all the brilliant things you didn't say, but can be read into your words by overactive N because hey, your words don't rule them out!

Figure and Ground.

 

[Tiltyred]

No, he pulls stuff out his ass just to troll. He makes sure to place the stuff he pulls out his ass where someone will step in it. He trolls. I'm sorry. I see you are attached to him, but he trolls.

 

[Thalassa]

I'm not attached to him. I'm defending him because I don't think he's a malicious troll, I think he's sincere, and yes he does do intentionally disruptive things, but he does it because he really feels that way and will use questionable methods so that people hear what he's saying.

 

[amerellis]

Yes, I meant misunderstood. Thanks for pointing that out.
Yes, that is how he likes to express himself, or he would do it another way.
And yes, he is more than aware enough to know he will be misunderstood, if by no other means than the long track record of it happening here.
I agree, if you aren't looking for concrete answers, his style is not confusing. I enjoy it.
And my original question still stands: why invite misunderstanding and ridicule?
Because he want to enlighten.
He spoke of the 'true self' and the 'ideal self'.
ideal self = ego consciousness/vanity/'I': makeup-as-metaphor, cover over true self
true self = soul/humility/'we': no need for makeup, no need to beautify.
I think he is often vague, partially because he enjoys the confusion that ensues. It amuses his ego to be so inscrutable.
The inscrutability is itself a form of makeup/covering. It makes people wonder whether or not they understand something. Clarity allows them to decide if they believe it.

I said knows/likes. Maybe that is the way he knows how to express himself, the way he thinks it is best fitted for him to express himself.
With that in mind my original question still stands: How do you know he is intentionally trying to cuase misunderstanding when that could just be the way he knows/thinks to express himself best?
The part in bold was the seemingly baseless assumption I was trying to get you to give concrete examples of earlier which you still haven't done.
[MENTION=5723]Tiltyred[/MENTION]: Neither of us can no for sure whether he is just "pulling stuff out of his ass" and trying to cause trouble as you believe or if he really believes what he is saying. I'm inclined to believe the latter and completely agree with what [MENTION=6877]Marmie Dearest[/MENTION] most recently wrote. But still, the fact remains that your opinion that he is a troll is just an opinion and cannot be proven.

 

[ICUP]

I'm not attached to him. I'm defending him because I don't think he's a malicious troll, I think he's sincere, and yes he does do intentionally disruptive things, but he does it because he really feels that way and will use questionable methods so that people hear what he's saying.

That's just what Vic wants us to believe, so he can continue damaging our lives and minds, or at least trying to. Vic is up to no-good. He's getting a big, fat jolly everytime he disrupts. No one who is genuine hurts, so they can help. These two things do not go together. At least, unless they are abusers who have somehow convinced themselves they are helping (ex/ paddling a child). Punishments, such as taking away an ipod for the weekend, supposedly work, but in that case, the parent is doing it "for their own good". I can't imagine a scenario where making me believe that Jung was a molestor would be "for my own good", to the point of causing me emotional distress in order to "learn better". Sounds more like Vic is playing God and doesn't like the idea of Jung being someone's "god". What right does he have to punish me to "teach" me his way? No, I won't join the cult of Victor.

As much as I would take up for Vic because I do feel bad thinking about the boat he's in (sucker I am, eh?), at the same time, I think it's ridiculous how some people are being so easily taken in.

He's a good wordsmith, and yes, he's intelligent. But he's not a creative or original mind, he's just different, and that stirs up curiosities in curious people.

 

[Antimony]

How much of this thread actually deals with wearing/not wearing makeup, and how much deals with whether or not Victor is trolling or is a troll?

 

[rav3n]

Don't forget the grudge matches!

 

[Antimony]

Don't forget the grudge matches!

There is no way I want to go through 16 someodd pages sorting through those.

 

[Viridian]

I think you nailed it with the Fi/Ni loop. I was previously thinking Ne-Fi or Fi-Ne with zero Te, but Fi/Ni sounds more like it. His writing does sound primarily Fi, structured like Ni, with no Ti or Te to allow tolerance for disagreement or logical analysis.

The Ni/Fi loop theory makes a lot of sense. I daresay it has a touch of 5w4, so I think he(?)'s INTJ. Of course, he'd roll his eyes at me typing him, but that never stopped me!

Yeah, I agree. I am inclined to overlook the word makeup and focus more on the word brands. I think that maybe he is talking about "things" like the newest vacuum cleaner or dryer ball or jetski- things that are meant to make you look better but when abused, take you much farther away from your true self and make you guarded, unable to have a good relationship, and unhappy. A coverup to your supposed ugly self, just like makeup.

(For post insurance purposes, I'm not talking about the three items listed above, I'm talking about the Jonses mentality.)

I'm not sure if that's what he meant by makeup, but that's what it made me think about when I read it. Of course, I'm inclined to take all of Victor's posts figuratively out of habit.

I got that too (although I lack the skills to decipher most of his postulates). Reminds me of Adorno, Horkheimer and other Frankfurt School writers's thoughts on the culture industry and capitalism.

 

[rav3n]

There is no way I want to go through 16 someodd pages sorting through those.

Clearly this thread is beyond entertaining.

Victor: Loves to enter other threads and thread jack. In this scenario, he sashayed into the makeup thread and stated that makeup is about branding and masking true self.
This thread: Many have entered, threadjacking it to the four corners of the Earth. And Victor holds the ultimate trophy for branding (everyone knows it's Victor's post without seeing his username) and masking (metaphoric ambiguity).

Who doesn't love this thread!