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  1. #1
    Senior Member Journey's Avatar
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    Wink Why is it wrong to oppress people?

    Postmodernism has sought to deconstruct every social institution, every meta-narrative (every narrative for that matter), every power structure basically because they believe they oppress people.

    Yet Postmodernists deny the existence of any moral absolutes whatsoever.

    So how can it be "wrong" to oppress people in a Postmodernist view?

    (I ask as a concession to my limitations that if you are a Postmodernist that you attempt a clarity of language that will, I know, be difficult for you. Attempt to avoid dense, jargon-laden and obscure, "demanding interpretation" on my part. Skip the fragmented, impressionistic and void of logical connections designed to be "democratically inclusive discourse" forcing me to interpret what is being said and to take an active role in the creation of meaning. Conner, Postmodernistic Culture, p. 210.)
    Last edited by Journey; 04-08-2008 at 11:38 AM.
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  2. #2
    Plumage and Moult proteanmix's Avatar
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    Where the hell is my Norton Anthology of Literary Theory and Criticism when I need it?! :steam:

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    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    That's one of the weaknesses with general postmodernism and deconstruction.

    Maybe your questions could be answered by watching "Terminator 2"?

    John Connor: You just can't go around killing people.
    The Terminator: Why?
    John Connor: What do you mean why? 'Cause you can't.
    The Terminator: Why?
    John Connor: Because you just can't, OK? Trust me on this.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

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    Senior Member ThatsWhatHeSaid's Avatar
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    It's not wrong! It's just not conducive to living a life of peace and clarity.

  5. #5
    Furry Critter with Claws Kiddo's Avatar
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    I don't kill people because other people don't kill me. If I started killing people then other people would have no reason not to kill me. In fact, they would probably even have the justification to do so because I would then pose a danger to them.

    It just makes logical sense and it has been summed up in the moral philosophy, "Do unto others as you would have them do unto you."
    Quote Originally Posted by Silently Honest View Post
    OMNi: Wisdom at the cost of Sanity.

  6. #6
    Senior Member Journey's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    That's one of the weaknesses with general postmodernism and deconstruction.

    Maybe your questions could be answered by watching "Terminator 2"?
    It's not just a weakness, it's a fatal flaw.

    I wouldn't expect a machine to have ethics. My problem may be expecting it of human beings. I have an answer for the Terminator. "Because God said it is wrong to murder, that is why." See how easy it is when you go with the Truth?

    Quote Originally Posted by ThatsWhatHeSaid View Post
    It's not wrong! It's just not conducive to living a life of peace and clarity.
    You must be a Postmodernist. That doesn't address the question at all. Who says that living a life of peace and clarity is right or wrong? More pertinently, is that your perceived basis for deconstruction?
    "My Journey is my Destination."

    "Today Counts Forever." R.C. Sproul

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    Senior Member prplchknz's Avatar
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    Do you want to be oppressed? besides what good does it do to oppress others? Everyone should have the chance to succeed and and the chance to fuck up in life, you can't do that if you're being held back.

    I don't know if that answered you're question, it's a hard question to answer.
    In no likes experiment.

    that is all

    i dunno what else to say so

  8. #8
    Senior Member Journey's Avatar
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    I was in a rather bitchy mood yesterday. I meant everything I said, but I didn't say it in the most diplomatic way, by any means. I'll try not to start any threads on "bad" days, lol. Apologies for any offense given.

    Deconstruction would be good, BTW, if they would use it on narratives like Darwinism...talk about being oppressive, it has human beings reduced to being ape descendents.
    "My Journey is my Destination."

    "Today Counts Forever." R.C. Sproul

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    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Don't worry about the cranky stuff, I've had my days recently too... We all go through it.

    Quote Originally Posted by Journey View Post
    Deconstruction would be good, BTW, if they would use it on narratives like Dawinism...talk about being oppressive, it has people reduced to being ape descendents.
    Usually the opposition to Darwinism occurs solely on that grounds: People can't reconcile what they are with the thought that they just might be part of the animal kingdom.

    Is that polarity necessary? Do we have to view people as either something "divinely special" that isn't naturally evolved, or else as purely animals with nothing special about them whatsoever?

    For whatever reason, we do seem to have the capacity for choice on some level, or at the very least self-awareness. Even if we are just part of the animal kingdom, we are STILL unique that way.

    I used to not want to believe in evolution, partly because I didn't want to believe it and partly because it didn't seem to make sense. I think, though, as technology increases and we more and more build scientific advances based on the exact same principles that evolution describes, that we'll see how plausible it actually is. The next hundred years should be very interesting in terms of social thought.

    So you can deconstruct the social insinuations that evolution might have spawned, but you can't really deconstruct a process based in the real world. (That's like saying you can somehow meaningfully deconstruct a chemical reaction.) Either it works or it doesn't.


    ... oh yeah... most of the time, humans don't give me any better logic than a machine does.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  10. #10
    Senior Member ThatsWhatHeSaid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Journey View Post
    You must be a Postmodernist. That doesn't address the question at all. Who says that living a life of peace and clarity is right or wrong? More pertinently, is that your perceived basis for deconstruction?
    I try to avoid labels. My ideas are based on my own experience, usually. I don't really know much about postmodernism, to be honest.

    No one says living a life of peace is right or wrong. It's a choice I make, myself. I don't impose that on anyone. The best you can do, imo, is ask people what they want. Most, if not all people, are looking for "relief" from their worries and drawing on experience, you can use argument to lead them to conclude that honoring life is a good way to find that relief.

    If I still haven't answered the question, show me where I failed.

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