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  1. #41
    Senior Member SRT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenaphor View Post
    Imagine living in a society where hate is revered and love is quashed. Are you both 100% certain that you'd still feel the same way?
    No, but why would that matter? Whether or not the origin of the feeling came from society or from myself doesn't change how I feel about the topic in this moment. And I'm okay with that, because there would be no way for me to completely separate the two.
    Everything that I express is simply an opinion with varying levels of support

    If I seem like a different type to you, I hereby give you permission to type me however you want.

  2. #42
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SRT View Post
    Did hate? Look, I'm of the opinion that perception counts for pretty much everything, regardless of whether or not something is objectively true. I think believing that love is a more powerful force than hate will have more positive and rewarding outcomes than the other way around. Odds are that it was a combination of the two (love of self/country/family/etc. and hate of enemy) that lead to the Axis being destroyed, but the combination would differ for every single person.
    Possibly. But without hate, the defeat wouldn't have happened.

    Now let's expand on the bolded. I challenge you with the same questions posed to Saturned and Giggly.

  3. #43
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SRT View Post
    No, but why would that matter? Whether or not the origin of the feeling came from society or from myself doesn't change how I feel about the topic in this moment. And I'm okay with that, because there would be no way for me to completely separate the two.
    Looks like we crossed posts. Aren't you interested in the "why"?

  4. #44
    Senior Member lowtech redneck's Avatar
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    Hate makes survival possible; love makes survival worth it.

    Yin-yang, all things in moderation, for all things there is a season, etc.

    Thinking of love as similar to 'social capital' (which likewise requires making oneself vulnerable in order to trust others, and emphasizing hope over fear) raises interesting questions; societies with the most 'bridging' social capital (social capital between different communities/cultures/etc) tend to have relative deficits of 'bonding' social capital (social capital within cultural communities, families, etc.), and vice versa. Does a similar thing occur with love, and what are the implications? Are love and hate inseprable from one another, and if so how can love towards close aquaintences and love toward strangers both be raised without sacrificing intensity in one for intensity in another?

  5. #45
    Anew Leaf
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenaphor View Post
    Is it personal experience or is it public perception that makes these two into positive and negative, building and draining?

    Imagine living in a society where hate is revered and love is quashed. Are you both 100% certain that you'd still feel the same way?
    This question reminds me of the end of 1984. He loved Big Brother.

  6. #46
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saturned View Post
    This question reminds me of the end of 1984. He loved Big Brother.
    Isn't Big Brother synonymous with love manifested in "for the good of all mankind"?

  7. #47
    Senior Member SRT's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Marmie Dearest View Post
    Oh yeah, this? I think it's due to not even being fully aware of what love or hate is, it's kind of a blindness, and a lack of self-awareness. A dangerous lack of self-awareness.
    YES. That's the word I couldn't think of. Self-awareness. Thank you, that was going to eat me up for awhile.

    Quote Originally Posted by Jenaphor View Post
    Looks like we crossed posts. Aren't you interested in the "why"?
    Yeah, I kinda assumed where you were going, so I answered that train of thoughts. What's the "why"?
    Everything that I express is simply an opinion with varying levels of support

    If I seem like a different type to you, I hereby give you permission to type me however you want.

  8. #48
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    Quote Originally Posted by SRT View Post
    No, but why would that matter? Whether or not the origin of the feeling came from society or from myself doesn't change how I feel about the topic in this moment. And I'm okay with that, because there would be no way for me to completely separate the two.
    I think it would still make a difference. Hate leads to destruction and death, so it wouldn't be revered in society for long because it goes against the instinct for life.

    I don't think it's going to happen, objectively speaking. I do not think it's a matter of perception, it's more of the reality that the results of love and hate...well, one is sometimes beneficial to people's lives (hate can be if it preserves their particular tribe against another, for example) but love is almost always beneficial to people's lives (reproduction, family, safety in numbers, community, blah blah blah).

    So, yeah, anyway, love objectively produces biologically sound results.

  9. #49
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SRT View Post
    Yeah, I kinda assumed where you were going, so I answered that train of thoughts. What's the "why"?
    It's not for me to say what the "why" is for you. If anything, I'm questioning perception and the social construct of love/hate. So I'm curious to hear everyone else's thoughts.

  10. #50
    Anew Leaf
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jenaphor View Post
    Isn't Big Brother synonymous with love manifested in "for the good of all mankind"?
    But we as the outsiders know that there is no love there and ultimately there is no good either.

    Unless one likes being a brain washed minion.

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