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  1. #11
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobble View Post
    Its a blessing that he choose me. But he didn't. These people are changing their own lives. It's not me. And its all do to blind faith. It allows them to be 100% without a single doubt in their mind beleave that their life is going to get better and telling yourself that your life is going to get better and beleaving it that strongly will make it happen. And knowing that I need them but they don't need me will make it impossible for me to be ok with using them that way. So blind faith is why.
    That would make sense, then.

    I guess it would be different for those who truly believe that God has picked and is using them to accomplish something important in the lives of others. Then it becomes a sacrificial calling (except for the narcissists, who start "taking their due").
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  2. #12
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobble View Post
    Blind faith.

    See because i could deal with taking there money in order to support me and my family. And I'd be ok with some of them volunteering there time to help maintain and run the church because I would know that God is changing their life's through me somehow and it is important that I remain open and available for anything God might need me for. Its a blessing that he choose me. But he didn't. These people are changing their own lives. It's not me. And its all do to blind faith. It allows them to be 100% without a single doubt in their mind beleave that their life is going to get better and telling yourself that your life is going to get better and beleaving it that strongly will make it happen. And knowing that I need them but they don't need me will make it impossible for me to be ok with using them that way. So blind faith would be why.
    I'm unsure what precisely is meant by blind faith, it would seem from what you said that you could be a calculating individual or charalatan and profit from being a preacher anyway, do you believe that blind faith is a necessary qualification for a preacher?

  3. #13
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    I'm unsure what precisely is meant by blind faith, it would seem from what you said that you could be a calculating individual or charalatan and profit from being a preacher anyway, do you believe that blind faith is a necessary qualification for a preacher?
    No but if becoming a preacher was a business decision and not a decision based my religious beliefs or something I felt god wanted me to do then I wouldnt fill comfortable with myself. But on the other hand if I had found religion and felt that god had wanted me to become a preacher and dedicate my life to helping people then I wouldn't feel bad about accepting donations or profiting off the church through fundraisers and rallies because it would allow me to continue to do god's work.

  4. #14
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobble View Post
    No but if becoming a preacher was a business decision and not a decision based my religious beliefs or something I felt god wanted me to do then I wouldnt fill comfortable with myself. But on the other hand if I had found religion and felt that god had wanted me to become a preacher and dedicate my life to helping people then I wouldn't feel bad about accepting donations or profiting off the church through fundraisers and rallies because it would allow me to continue to do god's work.
    Oh right, I thought you were suggesting that religion was a racket but you couldnt get a piece of that action since you could do a good enough impression of religious fervour or blind faith to be convincing to members of the congregation donating money, time and labour. Cheers for clearing that up

  5. #15
    LL P. Stewie Beorn's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobble View Post
    No but if becoming a preacher was a business decision and not a decision based my religious beliefs or something I felt god wanted me to do then I wouldnt fill comfortable with myself. But on the other hand if I had found religion and felt that god had wanted me to become a preacher and dedicate my life to helping people then I wouldn't feel bad about accepting donations or profiting off the church through fundraisers and rallies because it would allow me to continue to do god's work.
    Would you do it if you also got awesome sith lord powers?

    [YOUTUBE="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ydCVAff68oA&feature=related"]Benny Hinn[/YOUTUBE]
    Take the weakest thing in you
    And then beat the bastards with it
    And always hold on when you get love
    So you can let go when you give it

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    Oh right, I thought you were suggesting that religion was a racket but you couldnt get a piece of that action since you could do a good enough impression of religious fervour or blind faith to be convincing to members of the congregation donating money, time and labour. Cheers for clearing that up

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beefeater View Post
    Would you do it if you also got awesome sith lord powers?

    [YOUTUBE="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ydCVAff68oA&feature=related"]Benny Hinn[/YOUTUBE]
    God should of never gave him that. B-Hinny's old school though. You see that thunder bolt shit. Yah, that's all him. He always had that. He was gonna be an X-man but Congregation pays better.

  8. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jennifer View Post
    That would make sense, then.

    I guess it would be different for those who truly believe that God has picked and is using them to accomplish something important in the lives of others. Then it becomes a sacrificial calling (except for the narcissists, who start "taking their due").
    Even these guys though, why cant they work. Preachers never work. Why is that? I was in so many different churches growing up. Huge ones, small ones, one with people going crazy like that. Even like the small little church with like 45-50 people. Are they really that busy? Whats a normal week for them, anyone know?

  9. #19
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Bobble View Post
    Even these guys though, why cant they work. Preachers never work. Why is that? I was in so many different churches growing up. Huge ones, small ones, one with people going crazy like that. Even like the small little church with like 45-50 people. Are they really that busy? Whats a normal week for them, anyone know?
    Have you really bothered to talk to a number of different pastors?

    Some pastors DO have to work another job to make ends meet, which means they have less time for their church. So they are effectively working two jobs. Most normal people have trouble working two jobs without falling into exhaustion and still having time for the family.

    And, as I said in an earlier post, being a pastor is not a 40-hour-week job. It is more like a 60, or 80 hour a week job, and you can't even not answer the phone unless you get a system in place where other people intercept the calls. (Which means either volunteers or more paid staff.) People will not long support a pastor who isn't doing what they think he should be doing. It's like all the problems with politics, except the pastors are directly financially dependent upon the constituents, so even when they have legitimate needs that they really should honor in their personal lives, it's very easy for them to get burned when an issue goes political.

    People always have problems, and they seem to always expect the pastor to step in and deal with their problems -- either to give advice, or visit sick people, or run meetings, or give sermons, or practice music to stay at the top of their worship-leading game. This is changing somewhat with the flexier lifestyles of Gen X / Gen Y and younger, but especially with the Boomer hierarchy style of leadership, the pastor was expected to do everything.

    They are also expected to keep up with their studies (of the Bible, or org management, or whatever else they're expected to do). Some of them are continuing to take graduate level classes long after entering the career.

    And then what of the pastor's own family? It's not uncommon for pastors' kids to feel neglected if their mom or dad was always out helping other peopel with their problems. It's really hard to stake out time for oneself and one's own family unless the congregation is supportive of that and is willing to pick up the slack.

    Like I said, I was in lay leadership for ten years, have been in the church all my life, and worked closely with pastorship. More than a few of my closer friends are/were pastors. This isn't rocket science. Go talk to some pastors of different ages and from different denominations. You'll probably get some variety there, but I think the last answer you'll get is that it's some cushy job where you soak up cash while not doing anything. If that's your view, then you should stop using very top 1% megachurch pastors as your litmus test. Those guys are the exception.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  10. #20
    Dreaming the life onemoretime's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lark View Post
    Oh right, I thought you were suggesting that religion was a racket but you couldnt get a piece of that action since you could do a good enough impression of religious fervour or blind faith to be convincing to members of the congregation donating money, time and labour. Cheers for clearing that up
    Say what you want to about the Catholic priesthood - at least those tithes go to the Church organization as a whole.

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