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  1. #1
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    Default The price we pay

    The price we pay to get the things we want out of life. Equivalent exchange? Although, we know we don't always get back what we put in, depending upon how we judge the outcome. If it is within one man's ability and potential to obtain everything he desires, is it not cruel to be subject to the limitations of time and energy which ultimately crush his grand volition toward the attainment of all things good...

  2. #2
    ThatGirl
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    The universe is a succubus....

  3. #3
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    If we could "download our consciousness" into a robot body...thereby eliminating the constraints of time (we could potentially live forever) and energy (not completely) would we be, for all intents and purposes, more god like?

    Think about it..the only reason we aren't on the moon is because our bodies have needs that space can't meet. We have been focusing on trying to manipulate space to fit our needs. We could also be focusing on our needs to meet spaces standards..

    A body that doesn't need to breath, eat, sleep etc. Doesn't hurt. Every "disease" has a "cure". We could even make ourselves fly...explore the seas...explore space...the possibilities seem endless..

    And as time goes on...instead of our "bodies" deteriorating..they would improve. As technology improves so would our bodies...

    Why do people accept the limitation of their bodies?

    Why the hell aren't more people working on this?

    And when we have lived and done everything that we want to do in this consciousness we could have the option of having an off switch. We could even potentially experience death without having it be a finality...as long as someone is there to turn us back on..

  4. #4
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    I just thought of something...our bodies don't only bring us pain...they also bring us pleasure. Eating can be enjoyable. Sex is fun. I'm sure you could access these things in a "bodiless" existence...but would experiencing the euphoria of sex without the actual sex make it less enjoyable? It would be like a drug..something to indulge in...but ultimately meaningless. Assuming that there is a difference between "sex" and "making love" would our ability to "make love" be hindered in such a bodiless existence?

    I guess my question is..is it really all that cruel that our bodies are subject to the limitations imposed by time and energy? If given a choice..are we sure we don't choose to have our bodies be subject to these limitations?

  5. #5
    desert pelican Owl's Avatar
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    Quick (series of) question(s) for Risen: In what sense is it possible for the man to attain all things good? Specifically, in your post you mentioned that the limitations of time and energy crush the man's will to attain what would otherwise be possible for him to attain. What do you mean by this? Do you mean that the man, taking stock of his circumstances, realizes that he hasn't either the time or energy to attain all things good? Or, do you mean that, once he has taken stock of his circumstances, he realizes that attaining all things good isn't worth the time and energy required?

    Quick question for Mkenya: Granting that the pleasures made possible by bodily existence are also possible in a bodiless existence, is it necessary that a body that causes these pleasure must be subject to the limitations of time and energy in such a way that the limitations of time and energy make these pleasures unobtainable in a meaningful way? For example, why should we not just devise robot bodies for ourselves that enable us to have sex with one another in a way isomorphic to the way our present bodies enable us to have sex, etc.?

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    Well of course if you wish to achieve things you need to make developments, and that requires the forces of motivation and energy alike; if you can keep those things up, you will never cease to progress!

  7. #7
    likes this gromit's Avatar
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    Once you have basic necessities, there is a lot to enjoy in life that is free or costs very little.
    Your kisses, sweeter than honey. But guess what, so is my money.

  8. #8
    Emperor/Dictator kyuuei's Avatar
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    I'm glad you said that @gromit. It is a concept we have been struggling with a while now.. What is the meaning of what we need vs what we are conditioned to need?

    When I started introspecting on my life, I realized that most of my living space has been in less than 300 sq. ft. The rest are either pathways to those square feet.. And I was paying for about 1500 sq ft in total. I realized I wasn't using my money for what *I* wanted.. what I needed. I need to travel, and see the world. It is in my heart and soul. I was, instead, using my money for my car, for dolls and toys, etc. While I have affections for those things, they do not drive me the way my dreams do..

    It is a complete evaluation of life. Do we pay more for higher quality ingredients, new electronics that can make our lives easier, better cars that can help the environment, and work full time to afford an apartment/house and clothes and such? Or do we down size and stick with things that are slower and broken, save money by spending more time on things like cleaning and cooking, etc?

    Finding a balance between what my time is worth, and what my money is worth *to me* vs what it is worth to others has been an adventure I have been on the past year and a half. While I think I'm starting to locate the answers, the truth is I'm just starting to discover what all of this really means to me.
    Kantgirl: Just say "I'm feminine and I'll punch anyone who says otherwise!"
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  9. #9
    reflecting pool Typh0n's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by gromit View Post
    Once you have basic necessities, there is a lot to enjoy in life that is free or costs very little.
    It may be free for you, but its not free some kid in a sweatshop over in China.

  10. #10
    likes this gromit's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Typh0n View Post
    It may be free for you, but its not free some kid in a sweatshop over in China.
    ?

    I was speaking of things such as taking a walk, reading a book from the library, or having a little picnic.
    Your kisses, sweeter than honey. But guess what, so is my money.

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