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View Poll Results: Would YOU kill the baby?

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  • I'd kill it/get someone else to kill it

    32 48.48%
  • I would not kill it and risk the possibility of being heard

    34 51.52%
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  1. #141
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    If you had Tourette's syndrome and could not stop an outburst attack, would you kill yourself?

    What would you do if it was only you and the crying baby?

  2. #142
    figsfiggyfigs
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    Quote Originally Posted by MacGuffin View Post
    If you had Tourette's syndrome and could not stop an outburst attack, would you kill yourself?

    What would you do if it was only you and the crying baby?
    I wouldn't be hiding under the floor boards. I'd be a jungle person, I'd even name him Tarzan..


    In that sort of situation, there is a 1/1 ratio. It's not "for the greater good", and I'd probably take the risk.

  3. #143
    lab rat extraordinaire CrystalViolet's Avatar
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    I was thinking along the same lines as Oakysage, however I know I can be very pragmatic when the chips are down and survival instincts kick in, so I have a sneaking suspicion I could kill it if I needed to, and justify it (along the lines of what kind of life would it have had, if it lived?) in my head. If I survived, I'd be eaten alive with guilt, but I'd make damn well sure I did every thing I could to live to justify it. I wouldn't make some one else kill it either. My choice, my guilt. I'm pretty sure no-one would condemn me in the circumstances. They stood by and watched me after all.
    Currently submerged under an avalanche of books and paper work. I may come back up for air from time to time.
    Real life awaits and she is a demanding mistress.

    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  4. #144
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    I would silence the baby. If killing is the only way, then killing it will be.

  5. #145
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by MacGuffin View Post
    If you had Tourette's syndrome and could not stop an outburst attack, would you kill yourself?
    Yes, of course. Or I would ask the others to kill me.
    What would you do if it was only you and the crying baby?
    I'd like to say that I wouldn't kill the baby in that situation, but part of me thinks it might actually be emotionally easier to kill the baby with no witnesses. I would be very tempted. Assuming my instincts didn't take over, I might consider coming out of the cellar, and trying to distract the Nazis from killing the baby. Now, if the baby is definitely going to die either way, I might just decide to kill both the baby and myself, so that the Nazis don't get the satisfaction of doing so themselves. I'm pretty sure they'd enjoy it too much.

    So basically, chances are that I would do it at first to save myself, realize I couldn't live with it, and then kill myself. I think I could live with it if I did it save others, but not if I just did it to save myself.

  6. #146
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    Realistically I would probably panic trying to calculate the odds of the Nazi's finding us with and without the baby.

    I mean, there's the odds the Nazis won't come to the house. Quite high if I remember my history right. Then there's the odds the Nazis will find us anyway, even if I kill the baby, and the odds they wouldn't find us if I didn't.

    What I should be left with is the difference between the odds of group survival with and without the babies death. I'd take that number and multiply it by the sum of estimations of "how long each surviving member of the group would live if they got through this", "how happy they would be each minute of that time", "how happy they would make others" and "how much happiness they will create in future generations".

    I probably wouldn't finish the calculation in time.

    tl:dr: I'd try and calculate which option has the most potential happiness after it. Failing that, I'd act on instinct. I don't know what my instincts would do.

    EDIT: Oh, and the odds the Nazis would show mercy. Probably higher with a baby. I sometimes forget they weren't actually cartoonishly evil.

  7. #147
    Twerking & Lurking ayoitsStepho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by YWIR View Post
    Well. If I have learned anything from this thread, is that I'm never getting in a cellar with 12 of you.
    +10.


    Personally, if there's a chance that the Nazi's won't hear the crying baby, I'm not going to kill it. Even if the chances aren't in my favor. Either way, I'd be doing a whole lot of praying...
    Quote Originally Posted by MacGuffin View Post
    ayoitsStepho is becoming someone else. Actually her true self, a rite of passage.

  8. #148
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZPowers View Post
    Fine, considerably worse from an outside, bottom line and/or utilitarian view: to wit: kill the baby = dead baby, guilty conscience. Let it live= Baby still dies, probably in a more agonizing fashion, along with many other people, possibly including other children.
    Assumption once again. No one knows if the baby will cause everyone to be captured. No one knows if the Nazis will kill the baby in worse fashion. Perhaps they'll make it quick by shooting it which is most likely the case since Nazis were never known to waste time with human life that in their eyes, has no immediate gain to maintaining it.

  9. #149
    Protocol Droid Athenian200's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metaphor View Post
    Perhaps they'll make it quick by shooting it which is most likely the case since Nazis were never known to waste time with human life that in their eyes, has no immediate gain to maintaining it.
    No, the Nazi mentality was actually that they didn't want to waste bullets on Jewish people, but rather preferred to save them for the war. That's why they used the "showers" with the cheap Zyklon B poison when possible. They would also hang them, at times. Since a baby wouldn't put up a fight, they would be less likely to waste a bullet on it. They usually only had to shoot unruly prisoners who didn't go along quietly.

  10. #150
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Athenian200 View Post
    No, the Nazi mentality was actually that they didn't want to waste bullets on Jewish people, but rather preferred to save them for the war. That's why they used the "showers" with the cheap Zyklon B poison when possible. They would also hang them, at times. Since a baby wouldn't put up a fight, they would be less likely to waste a bullet on it. They usually only had to shoot unruly prisoners who didn't go along quietly.
    We could go on and on about what might be possible, including how the baby might die but overall, it's all assumption that the baby crying will cause everyone to be captured.

    Ethics/morality debates like this seriously annoy the hell outta' my Ni since there are so many other possibilities that don't require the situation to get to the proposed black and white decision point of kill or not. It's not too difficult to knock a baby unconscious to make it stop crying and while morally, it bothers me to hurt or harm a complete innocent, I'd be willing to do this in order to save other lives. But I draw the line at killing a complete innocent which is purely the underlying values that Fi sources. An emotional decision.

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