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View Poll Results: Would YOU kill the baby?

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  • I'd kill it/get someone else to kill it

    32 48.48%
  • I would not kill it and risk the possibility of being heard

    34 51.52%
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  1. #111
    Senior Member ZPowers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beargryllz View Post
    No, the baby doesn't realize that it is acting to kill you, but it is. The actions of the baby lead to your death, regardless of intention.
    This. A man who accidentally runs you over is still a man who kills you.

    Is causing indirect death through inaction as bad as murder to you? Your inaction would result in something tantamount to suicide and the death of the people you are with. Sad as it seems, in this situation, the baby CAN NOT be saved, period. Why is it less moral to make the child's death as quick as possible while preventing harm to befall yourself and others (hell, who says there aren't other babies and children, if we're appealing to innocence?)

    Additionally, it gives you a chance to actually do something with your lives to redeem the action, including doing something substantial to fight your oppressors. The others you are with have the same option if they live. Something better than an impotent, hopeless and desparate rush on armed soldiers.

  2. #112
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beargryllz View Post
    No, the baby doesn't realize that it is acting to kill you, but it is. The actions of the baby lead to your death, regardless of intention.
    Using this logic, should felons found guilty of manslaughter be chemically terminated?

  3. #113
    Cheeseburgers freeeekyyy's Avatar
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    It may lead to your death, but it is not killing you. It is not only not intending to kill you, it isn't killing you, period. The soldier is. The baby signifies your location, the soldier chooses to act on that. You can't control the actions that somebody else, (the soldier in this case) takes, but you can control your own actions. There are worse things than death, one of which is being a murderer.
    You lose.

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  4. #114
    Senior Member ZPowers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metaphor View Post
    Using this logic, should felons found guilty of manslaughter be chemically terminated?
    Malicious intent does count for something, it's true. But does lack of intent completely resolve guilt? If so, those convicted of manslaughter should face no punishment.

  5. #115
    Senior Member Beargryllz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metaphor View Post
    Using this logic, should felons found guilty of manslaughter be chemically terminated?
    Depends entirely upon the society. Some condone sanctioned murder, some don't. Furthermore, different criteria exist in different societies for what is worthy of this punishment. I would consider it a waste of human resources to terminate a person.

  6. #116
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by ZPowers View Post
    Malicious intent does count for something, it's true. But does lack of intent completely resolve guilt? If so, those convicted of manslaughter should face no punishment.
    A baby has no control or understanding similar to individuals found not guilty by reason of insanity.

  7. #117
    Ghost Monkey Soul Vizconde's Avatar
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    I would give it some hot sauce and then pop it in a cold shower
    I redact everything I have written or will write on this forum prior to, subsequent with and or after the fact of its writing. For entertainment purposes only and not to be taken seriously nor literally.

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  8. #118
    Senior Member Beargryllz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by freeeekyyy View Post
    It may lead to your death, but it is not killing you. It is not only not intending to kill you, it isn't killing you, period. The soldier is. The baby signifies your location, the soldier chooses to act on that. You can't control the actions that somebody else, (the soldier in this case) takes, but you can control your own actions. There are worse things than death, one of which is being a murderer.
    We are operating under the fact that the soldier will kill you, so the part where the soldier chooses to act is actually not a choice, but a predetermined circumstance for the scenario in question. It is a nice rebuttal, but it does not change the fact that the baby's action will result in your death. You said that you can control your own actions. This is true. Not only can you control your own actions, but you can also control the actions of the baby (by silencing it, or murdering it, if you prefer that word). You do not, however, control the actions of the soldier. We must work through an intermediary. The soldier's action is actually dependent on your action, because the only way you can control the soldier's action is by making him unable to act (killing the room of people). To make the soldier unable to act, the baby is silenced.

  9. #119
    Senior Member ZPowers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metaphor View Post
    A baby has no control or understanding similar to individuals found not guilty by reason of insanity.
    Or by neglect, assuming a sane case of manslaughter. No doubt. It is impossible to fault the baby.

    Essentially, this question has been asked and asked specifically of us infinite times and boils down to:

    "do you do something morally wrong or bad to prevent an inevitable outcome that is considerably worse than the results of the immoral action?"

    Probably everyone has some kind of tipping point. Do you kill a convicted killer to save the entire earth? Do you punch a child to save his life? Do you kill a doomed baby to save yourself and others?

    I'd say yes to all of them.

  10. #120
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Beargryllz View Post
    Depends entirely upon the society. Some condone sanctioned murder, some don't. Furthermore, different criteria exist in different societies for what is worthy of this punishment. I would consider it a waste of human resources to terminate a person.
    The first part about jurisdictional differences is a distraction since the bulk of the membership understand what manslaughter means. Then terminating a baby who might or might not give the hiding place away should also be a waste of human resources.

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