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  1. #1
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    Default Psychologically probing/confronting others

    I don't know if this is the right sub/forum for this, but, here we go.


    Something I'm very curious about is the nature of turning over the stones of how people's minds work. I do it with myself a lot, and I do it to other people to. It's a delicate process, and it can often be very unpleasant. It usually is unpleasant, because you start getting at people's egos and sense of self.

    I don't really know what to make of it anymore.

    I can help people in that regard, yes, but I can also be a tremendous asshole. I've wondered if my 'destiny' in life is to just disturb other people's psychological bases such that they see what errors and rationalizations they've created for themselves... even if that leaves me friendless. I've also considered exploiting it for my own gains, but, for whatever reason that doesn't ultimately appeal to me.


    I don't really know what my question is here, it's more.... do you relate? Or what do you do? at least at an amateur or hobby level, you must feel some sort of inclination to be psychologically invasive or explanatory in trying to address other people - I mean, you're at a forum called typologycentral, aren't you? So, what do you do with that?

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    Senior Member guesswho's Avatar
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    I do that to some people, but I think I do it out of curiosity, to see their reaction, and to see if what I think it right. However most of the time they just deny it, which spoils all the fun.

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    Yeah, I do this, but my technique is pretty passive. I'm almost attracted to people who have minds that I find interesting. I mostly tend to ask a lot of probing, probably annoying, questions.. probably less annoying than they could be, considering that I'm inventorying their insecurities, blind spots, traumas and knee jerk reactions. If they knew what I was doing, it'd be tough explaining that I'm truly interested and I'm not planning some sort of offense.

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    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
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    People are endlessly fascinating. But when someone opens up to the degree of showing vulnerability, why would anyone want to poke and prod or utilise this knowledge in a negative way? It says more (or less) about the individuals who choose to use vulnerabilities against people, than it does the individual who's willing to open up. And yes, that's a Fi judgment.

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    I guess my basic standards of operation are as follows:

    1. The world at large, I am not obligated to fix. That's not my job. And trying to "disturb other people's psychological bases" in a conscious way, as if I'm better than them and am going to fix them in some way, IS a negative thing to me.

    2. It's different if someone asks for the input. At that point, I am helping them with a goal they've already selected for themselves.

    3. If I am in a relationship with someone (close friends or family), then I have more leeway to speak my mind because I am part of a relationship; and it is the health of the relationship that I can be focused on, not necessarily "changing them." It's just that their problems to some degree become our problems, and my problems become our problems as well. Not only can I be more direct in engaging them, but I need to accept that they might be more direct with me; I have to be fair and accept criticism/challenge to the degree that I direct such at them.

    4. Where I can "shake people" is simply being myself in a communal sense. I shouldn't be someone else. There are measures of politeness/respect for boundaries that do not sacrifice integrity of self, and measures where you stifle who you are too much and thus cannot be a foil or help to anyone else. I'm not going to apologize for who and what I am just to allow someone else to avoid self-scrutiny; I just don't think I need to be looking for opportunities to dog someone all the time in order to "fix them." Change that is not self-directed is not change and won't last.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

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    darkened dreams labyrinthine's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jack View Post
    I can help people in that regard, yes, but I can also be a tremendous asshole. I've wondered if my 'destiny' in life is to just disturb other people's psychological bases such that they see what errors and rationalizations they've created for themselves... even if that leaves me friendless. I've also considered exploiting it for my own gains, but, for whatever reason that doesn't ultimately appeal to me.
    A big question here is how do you respond when someone else does this to you? Did someone help you by doing this, or does it make you angry and like they have no right to intrude that way? Knowing that answer will speak volumes about what is going on for you socially.
    Step into my metaphysical room of mirrors.
    Fear of reality creates myopic morality
    So I guess it means there is trouble until the robins come
    (from Blue Velvet)

  7. #7
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
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    To expand on my last post, how do you know your perception is accurate? In natural conversation, most people don't provide every little detail of every scenario, from every angle. So what you're getting is only partial information and if you ask questions, there's no way you can know what might be the right questions to ask that encompasses all possibilities, including the underlying foundations that cause individuals to act, react or perceive things in certain ways.

    If I were you, I'd be very careful about imposing your beliefs of right and wrongness, ethics or truthfulness (it's all subjective) on anyone else by messing around in their psyche. There isn't only one way to live, act or believe.

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    darkened dreams labyrinthine's Avatar
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    I guess in answering the actual OP, I more often do something close to opposite. I remain quiet or unresponsive and see what the other person's reaction is. I work with a few mentally unstable people who can fly off the handle to a degree that intimidates most people they interact with. They start those tactics with me, but I remain with minimal response, and it draws them down. They often start confessing how their thinking is wrong almost as if they recite what they would expect me to say if I were to lecture them about it. It's pretty interesting actually. People react in various ways with no response, but by not intruding into their space, whatever they offer can only come from them. I find out some true things that way.

    I don't think a person can be forced to see something in their own self. There are powerful issues of timing. Intruding into someone psyche might help in some cases, but it is rolling the dice because it could also cause damage. I see people's lives and psyches as almost unimaginably complex, dark, labyrinths.
    Step into my metaphysical room of mirrors.
    Fear of reality creates myopic morality
    So I guess it means there is trouble until the robins come
    (from Blue Velvet)

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    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Annwn View Post
    They start those tactics with me, but I remain with minimal response, and it draws them down. They often start confessing how their thinking is wrong almost as if they recite what they would expect me to say if I were to lecture them about it. It's pretty interesting actually. People react in various ways with no response, but by not intruding into their space, whatever they offer can only come from them. I find out some true things that way.
    Ironically, that's what typical good therapy involves. The therapist creates a space where the person can work through the issue and bring ideas to the forefront that usually get derailed by the aggressive interactions. You have to be patient and let someone sit in their own echo chamber.

    Which means trying to set someone straight can be derailing a more constructive healing process and reinforcing walls of denial, rather than helping someone.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  10. #10
    Senior Member guesswho's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metaphor View Post
    People are endlessly fascinating. But when someone opens up to the degree of showing vulnerability, why would anyone want to poke and prod or utilise this knowledge in a negative way? It says more (or less) about the individuals who choose to use vulnerabilities against people, than it does the individual who's willing to open up. And yes, that's a Fi judgment.
    I was not talking about people who open up, putting themselves in a vulnerable position. I was talking about people who annoy me.

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