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  1. #11
    Senior Member ceecee's Avatar
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    The one thing I have always done is not give more information than the question requires. Like the prostitute question - someone who has sex for money. That's a perfect answer, age appropriate of course. We don't lie to our kids. Other than it's the wrong thing to do, children discovering the truth from someone else kind of shakes their little world and the people they should trust the most, you the parent, is a little shattered. If you lie because you're uncomfortable answering questions, tough shit. Suck it up and do the right thing by your child.

    I agree with Jennifer about Santa/The Tooth Fairy/Easter Bunny things. I have great memories of these from my own parents and my children do as well. Those "myths" have evolved into cherished traditions that we still observe, even though all our kids are much older now. For example, when my oldest son was small he was very concerned about how Santa would get in the house. We didn't have a fireplace and he didn't want Santa ending up in the furnace. I found an old fashioned skeleton key, tied it with ribbons and we hung it on a nail outside the back door. This was a great solution for him and a tradition we still do every Christmas Eve, even though we now have two fireplaces in our house. My husband's children were just tickled with the key as well, even though it was a totally new tradition for them. Just like they thought it was magical when I sprinkled a little glitter on their pillow when I left money as the Tooth Fairy. That's what my dad did for me, it was a cool thing to do.
    I like to rock n' roll all night and *part* of every day. I usually have errands... I can only rock from like 1-3.

  2. #12
    Senior Member angelhair45's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Evan View Post
    This is exactly why I think it's situational. Some kids will see through the bullshit, so telling them the truth is definitely the way to go. Lying will just make them wonder what the hell is going on, and lead them to question their own analytical abilities.

    Other kids might understand that it's fantasy at some level, but actually have fun playing around with the stories -- in that case, there may be potential gain in playing with them. Yes, it's not necessarily the truth, but some kids aren't even focused on that.

    Other groups of kids might just not get it at all, so lying about reality will just confuse them more. Bad idea in this case.

    So yeah, it depends on the kid. But in most cases, the truth is good anyway.
    We've always been honest about Santa and the tooth fairy, or asked, "what do you think?" etc. We have let him take the lead, but when flat out asked, I tell the truth. He's six, we've never told him Santa was real, in fact we've told him the opposite when he asked, but he decided he believes in Santa Claus anyway. So there you have it...

    My poor kid had to deal with the reality of death at 4 when he was diagnosed with type 1 diabetes after being in the hospital for 2 weeks because of DKA and then a blood clot. Trying to explain death and a lifetime illness is the hardest thing ever. Believe me, I wanted to lie to him. It's tough to know what they can and cannot handle. How to bring them knowledge without fear...

    Anyway, I am extremely honest and up front with my son...
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  3. #13
    Senior Member Synapse's Avatar
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    Children are intelligent beings and know before you tell them, they react profoundly to your emotional states, much more than you are able to understand. And in that respect the impact you have on their development is constrictive. For you speak your truth without understanding and they already know and so you don't speak your truth thinking your protecting them from harm but harming them thinking your educating them from truth.

    In other words when you express yourself from loving energy then you are expressing truly. When you are expressing from insecure and critical energy then you are attacking and mistrustful of their intentions, your intentions, every ones intentions and the reverberation travels like an ear listens to the chains that seal their self. When they know how to bend an ear, when they demand attention and children do you hear communication that is unwanted and then punish that reaction except that is a learned response to what they tune into. Like radio frequencies they are going to zone into what is and isn't and in doing so learn the should's and shouldn't just like the black and white reality that seems to define navigation of what is supposed to be a mindful human condition.

    Except when you change children and become deferential to kid that means the respect, granted, isn't and then the language that is spoken on a subconscious level becomes audible in the present tense as a communication platform that again makes way for confusion.

    School, society, friends, indeed parents, hardly prepare their children towards reality and truth. For the truth is your already blocking their truth from manifesting into belief, esteem and confidence unless you are all of those things yourself. They've tuned into the frequency of the negative energy that reinforces the values of a society that limits its potential of positive expression into a form of attack. Just like absorbing energy that is negative after a conflict, or when you pass a space and your hairs stand on edge thinking there is some kind of danger here you can feel it. Indeed like a emotional spot of negative energy your children would soak up those values that most reflect your presence in their lives. Whether constructive or destructive depends upon your own demeanor, shape and how "well" you were prepared to express your truths, trusts and protect your children from everything that you thought is right.

    And you are right to do so. As long as its not deferential towards them as it has been to you.

    ha I talk too much, I don't even have children yet, what the bleep would I know. Airy fairy dust.

  4. #14
    Senior Member Nicodemus's Avatar
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    If one is cruel enough to bring a child into this world, one might as well tell the truth about it.

  5. #15
    Tenured roisterer SolitaryWalker's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Magic Poriferan View Post
    Discussion time, class!

    The general question is; how much should children be told the truth??!
    Ivan Turgenev once said that an intelligent man's task is to gently open one's eyes rather than tear them out, however, there are compelling reasons to question that the intelligent man will have the incentive to even attempt to open them.

    There are economical and moral benefits of "lying to children". Books of popularizers who simply scientific, spiritual and philosophical ideas tend to sell with far greater success than those of writers who display intellectual honesty. In the heyday of modern capitalism, money dictates much of our rational self-interest and as a result there is simply very little room for the community activity of truth-telling.

    We also ought to remember that although many of us are adults by law, we are still children with respect to our intellectually development. Very few forum members enjoy reading challenging material or for that matter have even had a single intellectual challenge in their lives. The same can be said about the majority of contemporary Western persons. It is therefore questionable whether it is possible to open the eyes of most people without tearing them out.
    "Do not argue with an idiot. They drag you down to their level and beat you with experience." -- Mark Twain

    “No man but a blockhead ever wrote, except for money.”---Samuel Johnson

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  6. #16
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
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    I think it's interesting to review the evolution of fairy tales from medieval times until the present day... where they've basically been sanitized and only now are "darker" kids stories being allowed back into circulation. You even see it in religious instruction, where darker anecdotes and truths are whitewashed, and kids don't even realize the stories actually exist or that they aren't nearly as rosy as they were taught.

    Kids obviously can handle and learn from some pretty rough stuff, and even enjoy it. Western culture's fear of death doesn't really help either.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  7. #17
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    Ideas have consequences.

    A child's zone of proximal development is vital to their understanding and use of information and knowledge, cognition develops you dont arrive into the world with it, so much should be obvious from a typology website, and consequential thinking doesnt develop until 19 or 20 and very possibly later in life now.

    So you see there is after all a reason why we have an age of majority and why children are not privilege to the same information and knowledge as adults, why we dont give children interested in cherry bombs or fireworks the information to build coffee jar bombs.

  8. #18
    The Memes Justify the End EcK's Avatar
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    Yeah. But the real issue is that most people believe in 'truths' that are in no way based in any sort of empirical knowledge.
    What kids need is to encouraged to think for themselves, to question things.

    You can always edit information, it's harder to edit a deeply set frame of mind.
    Expression of the post modern paradox : "For the love of god, religions are so full of shit"

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    ... In theory.

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  9. #19
    Senior Member alcea rosea's Avatar
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    Child should be told as much as s/he is capable of understanding in her/his age.

  10. #20
    Writing... Tamske's Avatar
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    I fear already for my future children, because I'm unable to lie. But I think it's necessary at first because you've got to simplify the world. I don't fear questions like "what's a prostitute?" but questions like "how does a television work?"
    Because a television needs electricity, waves, fosforescence (or LEDs),... I fear I will make it much too complicated just because I don't want to lie about television fairies or something! I really need to find out simplified versions of everything.
    Also - Sinterklaas (the dutch/flemish version of Santa Claus) I'd like to hold the tradition of putting out shoes with a carrot for the horse, drawing the saint and his boat, singing songs etc... but I don't want to put lots of efforts making them believe it. My husband is afraid that if we tell the truth from the beginning, the child will not believe us because all the other people tell them Santa Claus is real...
    My parents didn't make the effort and I'm still thankful because of that. I realized he was make-believe when I was four or five years old. We still put out shoes and everything because I loved to play at make-believe.
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