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  1. #11
    morose bourgeoisie
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    read The Ghost in the Machine by Arthur Koestler. It's about the disconnect between the rational, and emotional part of the human brain, which he saw as the root of violence and warfare.

    Amazon.com: The Ghost in the Machine (Arkana) (9780140191929): Arthur Koestler: Books

  2. #12
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    Quote Originally Posted by Little_Sticks View Post
    Well, war is the collective desire of more than one person to destroy other life. There are various degrees of war in various scopes, and you can nitpick, but I'm focusing on the most destructive one, and attempting to correlate it with aggression, which I believe will still explain your nitpicking. So instead of attempting to clarify and focus on what I have talked about you have added nothing to the discussion, where I was willing to spill out my private thoughts, and that makes you a genuine troll. There, I recognized and gave you attention; are you pleased now? And I think you might like INTP central more.
    I wonder if you've actually experienced war or if you're just feeding your own bullshit theory with your own naive impression of it. And no you are right I was trollin' but you don't make it easy for a brotha not to. I wonder if your not used to critique or if they ruffled your hair over at INTPc. There is no beauty in killing others but the world isn't beautiful, and some people in the less comfortable parts of the world don't have that luxury to begin with.

    So you'll have to excuse me for not being able to take you seriously. One thing you could do is post a few pics if your napalm burned, barbwire scarred body. That would at least give you fair ground to stand on for those opinions you expressed.

  3. #13
    Senior Member Survive & Stay Free's Avatar
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    I dont think war is beautiful, I've experienced the low intensity warfare of NI and I think I know what I'm talking about.

  4. #14
    Senior Member Little_Sticks's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Within View Post
    I wonder if you've actually experienced war or if you're just feeding your own bullshit theory with your own naive impression of it. And no you are right I was trollin' but you don't make it easy for a brotha not to. I wonder if your not used to critique or if they ruffled your hair over at INTPc. There is no beauty in killing others but the world isn't beautiful, and some people in the less comfortable parts of the world don't have that luxury to begin with.

    So you'll have to excuse me for not being able to take you seriously. One thing you could do is post a few pics if your napalm burned, barbwire scarred body. That would at least give you fair ground to stand on for those opinions you expressed.
    No, I just don't like the idea of not being able to discuss an idea. If you don't like it or think it is stupid then please point out why in whatever main ideas I have. Don't troll or ridicule me for attempting to discuss an idea. Not all ideas are going to be great, but some will. This is what I meant by INTPc from my experience...and I don't think I have to have had to have been in a war to learn about the experiences and emotions of others that have been in a war. It isn't even about that.

    And look, I was inspired by an idea and attempted to spill it out into the OP of the thread. That wasn't my intention. I was inspired by the 'positive idea' of what good it can lead to further down the line. Some of it might seem stupid in that regard since I seem to be glorifying war; I got excited by idea that misery and pain lead to good things further down the line - the idea that the struggles of mankind lead to good. It's just a nice thought to me...to think that someone who has been torn by conflict, although broken and torn, will have progressed mankind towards peaceful means. After learning to live homeless for about a year now because I can't sleep in apartments (noise makes crazy and can't afford it anyway) and feel very anxious if I have to live with anyone or talk to anyone for long periods of time (can't live with someone) I have finally found a way to get enough peace of mind that I don't get severely depressed and think about suicide. But I get tired and it still feels like a huge struggle. I had a problem in the past with chronic fatigue resulting from apartments and living with people. I'm like an animal, movements and human beings set my adrenaline off. I'm a little crazy. And I kind of paralleled that with the idea of this thread. It doesn't at all compare to being in a war, but I was thinking about the parallel of struggle and aggression of human beings. It's a nice thought.

    But I still hold by the idea that human beings like to have a certain measure of security. I think this security manifests itself into governments and laws that keep people in a certain security box. Once a box has been set, it has to be destroyed if another box is going to be set. War destroys the box. Without war, the security of the box stays, even if that security is a harmful one. Freedom isn't free...you have to fight for what you need and want...that's life...and in the worst cases...that's war...and I do understand that. What's nice about democracies is that the box becomes very versatile...but it's still just a box...with its everlasting limitations. War has the potential to set a better box, one that will reduce future wars and give more people what they need and want out of life, even if that's part of a changing philosophy.

    Edit: I see no reason to believe that this isn't the progression that wars follow. We have come from building castles and fortresses and spending our time killing each other as a norm to building complex societies that don't revolve around how you can kill your enemy and take and use what they have. To get to this point people had to stand up to those in power that won't back down without a fight and have a war and win it. If they did nothing, would anything have changed? Does anyone at least understand what I'm talking about?
    Last edited by Little_Sticks; 09-25-2010 at 04:15 PM. Reason: trying to clarify

  5. #15
    Senior Member Chunes's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Savage Brain View Post
    Since when are murder, destruction, death, and chaos considered to be beautiful (if your not a psychopath)?
    If we did not suffer these things, we'd be unable to understand the concepts of creation, life, and order. I wouldn't say war itself is beautiful at all. It's ugly and hateful. But the picture war helps paint in the grand scheme of things is indeed beautiful.
    "If you would convince a man that he does wrong, do right. But do not care to convince him. Men will believe what they see. Let them see."
    Thoreau

  6. #16
    Senior Member WildCard's Avatar
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    I understand that war can lead to more peaceful, beautiful things. And I think the OP is on to something when he says that those who haven't experience war, and those who haven't been exposed to its effects are more prone to have it.

    However, I don't find war beautiful. I have been exposed to rifle fire, mace, explosions, and trained to kill a human being effeciently. As a matter of fact, the hairs on the back of my neck still stand up when I fire my rifle, or hear shots.

    Can war lead to better things, yes. Do I wish there was an alternative to it? Absolutely.
    Anything that you haven't fought for isn't going to be appreciated. It takes blood, sweat, and a large amount of tears before you appreciate what you have.

  7. #17
    resonance entropie's Avatar
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    [YOUTUBE="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_gHECKJSAnE"].[/YOUTUBE]

    Nice version btw
    [URL]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEBvftJUwDw&t=0s[/URL]

  8. #18
    Striving for balance Little Linguist's Avatar
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    I have NEVER NEVER NEVER understood some people's glorification of war. Ugh. Disgusting.

    These people are generally people who haven't got a goddamn clue what war is really all about. They have watched movies, read books, seen pictures of guys filled with camaraderie, watched some weirdo documentary or news broadcast and think war is this big, grand thing that brings people together despite differences. It's a time when no one gives a rat's ass if you're this or that because we're all fighting for *ahem*

    *drum roll*

    THE CAUSE!

    FUCK IT!

    I'd like to see these guys in a real war. They'd probably be the ones shitting in their pants when the battle starts and barfing when they see their best friend's organs get blown to bits.

    So shut it with this blah blah blah war brings out the best in people. DAMN.

    /end rant

    Anyway, this wasn't a reaction to anyone in particular or even here, but I have seen/heard so MANY people do this and ugh.

    Now, sure, I respect soldiers who get up and fight. And I think they SHOULD be remembered and honored. But that doesn't mean bloody dream about being a soldier in another damned world war. Gosh, there are boundaries, you know.

  9. #19
    Senior Member Chloe's Avatar
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    when i was a kid i grew up playing with this:



    [we had it at home and called it kinder egg]

    not beautiful.

  10. #20
    Senior Member You's Avatar
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    War is interesting and necessary. That doesn't equal beautiful. I won't elaborte because I got shit to do.
    Oh, its
    You
    ....

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