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  1. #151
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    Quote Originally Posted by spamtar View Post
    Some Christians are prejudiced against homosexuals. Others are not. My friend belongs to one Christian church where the pastor is an openly gay female in a "partnership". So similar to how all gays are not the same neither are all Christians. I would agree that a majority of Christian fundamentalist do not look on homosexuality favorably. They think it is a sin for its own sake regardless of the consequences.
    Well. Yes. Things change. Remember that the bible is also the originator for the strong racism that occurred through the last millennia. It's written over and over about the superiority of the white man. Through curses people became black skinned, marry across races and death will strike. It's actually more references to racism in the bible, then it is against homosexuality. But there is not much racism going on in the church today I think, or is there? I don't know, there is at least gay suppression. Maybe because they can still get away with it?

  2. #152
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Victor View Post
    The first question they ask when we are born is, "Is it a boy or is it a girl?".

    So gender is a fundamental distinction with which we order the world.
    The first question I ask is: is it healthy/OK? You are correct in that male and female are universal constants. The physical is just one aspect of this duality, however, as others have pointed out. The "women's movement" addressed this in certain ways, and the "GLBT movement" (for lack of a better term) is addressing it in others. Ideally, we will eventually be able to see each other first and foremost for the individuals we are, without making the elements of our diversity into artificial limitations.

    Quote Originally Posted by sleepy View Post
    Well. Yes. Things change. Remember that the bible is also the originator for the strong racism that occurred through the last millennia. It's written over and over about the superiority of the white man. Through curses people became black skinned, marry across races and death will strike. It's actually more references to racism in the bible, then it is against homosexuality. But there is not much racism going on in the church today I think, or is there? I don't know, there is at least gay suppression. Maybe because they can still get away with it?
    I wonder sometimes if the whole "light is good, dark is evil" symbolism running through the Bible contributed to the racial prejudice we still experience today. That entire premise to me is harmful and just plain false.

  3. #153
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kasper View Post
    Why does religion see homosexuality as so darn evil?
    ...because its gay

  4. #154
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    Quote Originally Posted by sleepy View Post
    Well. Yes. Things change. Remember that the bible is also the originator for the strong racism that occurred through the last millennia. It's written over and over about the superiority of the white man. Through curses people became black skinned, marry across races and death will strike. It's actually more references to racism in the bible, then it is against homosexuality.
    I think it's rather a stretch to say that the Bible is the "...originator for the strong racism that occurred through the last millennia." The story usually thought of as involving a person being "cursed" with dark skin is the story of Noah's son Ham, ancestor of the Caananites. If you go back and read the story, however, it never actually mentions the color of his skin. Ham was cursed, yes, but his color never changed in the biblical account. I think the apocryphal references to his skin color were probably made up by wishful Baptist preachers in the 19th century.

    I think it's fairest to say not that the Bible is the cause of racism, but rather that the Bible reflects the racism of the people it portrays. If the Bible were a primary cause of racism, then it would be hard to account for the historic racism found in the Middle East and Asia (of which there was plenty). Historically, the Bible was never a significant cultural influence in these areas.

  5. #155
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    IIRC Blacks were largely seen as exotic curiousities in Medieval Europe, not really as inferior savages per se. Plus there were devotions to Black saints such as St. Maurice.


    Meeting of St Erasmus and St Maurice by Matthias Grunewald, 1524

  6. #156
    Oberon
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    ...Not to mention another African, one Augustine of Hippo. I bet you've heard of him.

    EDIT: Okay, he was NORTH African. He probably still looked like a Berber.

  7. #157
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    I haven't read anything in here yet. but I will.

    From the top of my head.
    As simply as I can put it.

    I would say, religious hate the gay because apparently God said that sex, marriage, and love should be only between a man and woman.
    Homosexuality defy that rule, thus defying the religion. If it exists, it questions peoples beliefs, as in " if god doesn't allow it, why is it happening??" also "you're defying god by doing this".

    It's a threat to peoples foundation in their religion. Thus, religious folk think it's unholy. or w.e...

    I think it's idiotic to care about what others are doing just based on your own religious beliefs. What gives you the right to judge others happiness and way of life when they are not harming anyone?

    ps: religion isn't really my favorite subject : )

  8. #158
    Artisan Conquerer Halla74's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Kasper View Post
    Why does religion see homosexuality as so darn evil?
    (1) Ignorance

    (2) Closet Tendencies
    --------------------
    Type Stats:
    MBTI -> (E) 77.14% | (i) 22.86% ; (S) 60% | (n) 40% ; (T) 72.22% | (f) 27.78% ; (P) 51.43% | (j) 48.57%
    BIG 5 -> Extroversion 77% ; Accommodation 60% ; Orderliness 62% ; Emotional Stability 64% ; Open Mindedness 74%

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    "If somebody asks your MBTI type on a first date, run". -Donna Cecilia
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  9. #159
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    Quote Originally Posted by Halla74 View Post
    (1) Ignorance

    (2) Closet Tendencies
    I agree. You're secretly a Catholic, aren't you.

    Can't fool me, man... You set off my Ca-dar from day one!

  10. #160
    Superwoman Red Herring's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kyuuei View Post
    I'm glad you cleared this up. I always thought people asked because there isn't much else to ask about besides, "What are you going to name it?" and "When is s/he due?"
    Actually, Victor is right about this. There have been empirical studies where adults were shown a baby in diapers without knowing its gender - they were extremely uncomfortable and continously tried to find out if it was a boy or a girl, a "he" or a "she" they saw. It´s deeply engrained.
    Also, the same action of a baby get´s different reactions depending on what gender it supposedly has: boy = "look at that little rascal!" girl: "she´s a bit rough, isn´t she?" (and vice versa)
    The good life is one inspired by love and guided by knowledge. Neither love without knowledge, nor knowledge without love can produce a good life. - Bertrand Russell
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