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  1. #11
    Member Dying Acedia's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by onemoretime View Post
    Analyze the validity of that sentence.
    What? Why would we invoke magic at all? Science is a tool and a body of knowledge. Sure, magic could be that too, but magic isn't something that is clearcut and logical, so I think this is invalid.

  2. #12
    Senior Member You's Avatar
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    I must be science.

  3. #13
    desert pelican Owl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by onemoretime View Post
    Analyze the validity of that sentence.
    Not too sure how you are using the word "validity" above.

    But...

    For those who adopt a pragmatic theory of truth, I imagine that this sentence wouldn't be a too objectionable definition of science, and if, in this thread's title, the word "magic" were replaced by "behavior", then I predict that pragmatists wouldn't balk at its validity.

    However, I'm no pragmatist, so I don't think that science is merely behavior that works. "Science," as I understand the term, is the use of our cognitive faculties to understand the relations that hold between objects in the realm of mind independent existence that is accessible through the senses.

    Admittedly, I'm no scientist, and much science often seems like magic. In fact, I was just wondering today how ancient civilizations, (and some not so ancient), would treat contemporary scientists and their ideas.

    what do you, (omt), think of your sentence?

  4. #14
    DoubleplusUngoodNonperson
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    oh man, how does that quote from civ4 go......

    "any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic"

    If you look at the most amazing/surprising results from the physical sciences in the past 100 years (I think atomic weaponry and Lasers are the most impressive, myself), you'll see it actually goes far above and beyond most things presented in Harry Potter or even Advanced Dungeons and Dragons. So I would say it's a pretty valid statement.

    What's a myth is how quickly one can achieve those effects described with all the labor and machinery involved in development. If science were magic, casting/preparing an atomic bomb spell would take 5 years or longer :P not very prompt, is it?

  5. #15
    Senior Member Saslou's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by KazeCraven View Post
    What? Why would we invoke magic at all? Science is a tool and a body of knowledge. Sure, magic could be that too, but magic isn't something that is clearcut and logical, so I think this is invalid.
    The wording within science can not be used in the context of magic.

    This is why it is currently invalid .. Change the language then see the magic
    “I made you take time to look at what I saw and when you took time to really notice my flower, you hung all your associations with flowers on my flower and you write about my flower as if I think and see what you think and see—and I don't.”
    ― Georgia O'Keeffe

  6. #16
    insert random title here Randomnity's Avatar
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    You would have to define science, magic and "works" (not to mention "validity") concretely in order to examine the validity.

    It does sound like you mean technology more than science, though.

    But sure, to civilizations with far less developed technology, modern technology would certainly seem like magic, if that's all you mean.
    -end of thread-

  7. #17
    nee andante bechimo's Avatar
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    That phrase rubs me the wrong way. Preferred statement:

    Magic is a combination of unexplained science and fantasy.

  8. #18

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    Someones been reading Richard Matheson's Button, Button or seen any of the adaptations (either twilight zone or film) or read the original quote, which I think is from Asimov but I'm not sure.

  9. #19
    insert random title here Randomnity's Avatar
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    I believe Arthur C. Clarke was the original quote: "Any sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic". His other two laws from the same source are good too: "When a distinguished but elderly scientist states that something is possible, he is almost certainly right. When he states that something is impossible, he is very probably wrong." and "The only way to discover the limits of the possible is to go beyond them into the impossible."
    -end of thread-

  10. #20
    Senior Member You's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Metaphor View Post
    That phrase rubs me the wrong way. Preferred statement:

    Magic is a combination of unexplained science and fantasy.
    Rub some more.
    Oh, its
    You
    ....

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