User Tag List

First 6789 Last

Results 71 to 80 of 87

Thread: Prayer

  1. #71
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Enneagram
    5w6 sp/sx
    Posts
    17,518

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by gromit View Post
    While I'm not sure I believe in the Jesus story in a literal sense (like life after death, etc. - it could be true, but I have no way of confirming it) I do find the imagery to be powerful and to touch upon deep meaning and our experience as human beings. I don't know. I find it resonates with me at a level deeper than literal. The idea of pain, sorrow, agony, and of new life again, of transformation, healing through darkness, etc, that true love is found as much in sorrow as it is in joy. So I guess this ties into my ideas of prayer somehow. I guess what I consider 'prayer' is a part of this process, maybe it IS the process. Allowing yourself to go into that inner, spiritual part of yourself, to face whatever it is in there that's causing the pain, to find love and healing from the spiritual dimension of the universe, including others, and to move toward wholeness.
    The Jesus story resonates powerfully with many because it taps into a powerful archetype, that of Deity enduring an ordeal in the underworld to vanquish Death and allow Rebirth. This is present in many spiritual traditions, most predating Jesus, and was associated with the historical Jesus by certain groups of his earliest followers. Perhaps they saw it as an apt metaphor for the significance of his teachings and example; perhaps they did it just to gain more followers. In any case, it stuck, and now often overshadows the actual content of Jesus' life and teaching.

  2. #72
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Enneagram
    5w6 sp/sx
    Posts
    17,518

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by gromit View Post
    On another note, anybody pray to a female deity/female deities?
    Yes. Omitting the female from the Divine is like ignoring the mother in the family. Even the Bible says something like: "God created man [humanity] in His own image; male and female he created them". To me, this means God contains both masculine and feminine. We do a disservice to both God and ourselves when we ignore half of this duality.

  3. #73
    Priestess Of Syrinx Katsuni's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    MBTI
    ENTP
    Enneagram
    3w4?
    Posts
    1,238

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    Yes. Omitting the female from the Divine is like ignoring the mother in the family. Even the Bible says something like: "God created man [humanity] in His own image; male and female he created them". To me, this means God contains both masculine and feminine. We do a disservice to both God and ourselves when we ignore half of this duality.
    Moreso yeu do a disservice to god by trying to attach human qualities to something which's supposed to be above such XD

    God supposedly has no physical form, no hormones running through his brain, and no gender in general as he doesn't need to procreate with himself.

    The term "him" is as close to neutral as can be reasonably attained as 'he' is in both 'he' and 'she', so most people just go with that. True, it gives a somewhot masculine taint there, but whot can yeu do since 'it', although more technically accurate, is usually reserved for inanimate objects.

    We just don't HAVE a neutral pronoun in the english language is all, at least not one for animate people. There's no indeterminate "I don't know whot they are". Yeu HAVE to assume he or she because of how the language works.

    Some have tried to get around this with silly pronoun bastardizations such as "hir" and "shi", or "the Sun of God" but it just gets weird then, and honestly doesn't work. son =/= sun XD

    Anyways, if god is anything, he's not human, and it's kind of dumb to attach human traits onto something which's supposed to be greater than humans in all ways.

    That being said, it's far more likely that the line that we were "created in his image" is not anything remotely related to fact at all, but rather, just a feeble attempt as self-divine-ification by turning us into demi-gods of a sort.

    Humans have this irrational need to distance themselves from the rest of the animals and 'prove' we are of divine origin. Happens in most religions. And most mythologies.

    Yeu have to remember when the old testament was written... there's alot of stuff that bled over from other religions, pagan beliefs, and mythology.

    So no, I don't think that if god exists at all, that he has any gender, since gender is a physical trait primarily; yes, there are differences elsewhere, but the thing is that the brain can be male or female, and the body can be male or female, and yes these two may not coincide, such as in the case of transgenders, but these are both PHYSICAL issues. As I'm going to go out on a limb, and state that not having a corporeal form also means not having a physical brain, with hormones, chemicals and other stuff running through it, tilting the perceptions and processes therein, that god can't possibly HAVE a gender.

    The only exception would be Jesus, and there's no proof he ever existed; the shroud of turin was disproven by several hundred years, there's no record of his execution, which was pretty well documented by the romans at the time, and he didn't exist in the bible at all until 300ad when a group of romans decided whot to put into the bible in the first place that isn't in the other books its' based off of. As such, yeu don't see Jesus in the other holy books. Jews consider him a prophet of god, but not the son thereof. As such, we'll just assume that he doesn't count in terms of gender.

  4. #74
    Senior Member Valuable_Money's Avatar
    Join Date
    Jun 2009
    MBTI
    ENTP
    Enneagram
    5w6
    Posts
    681

    Default

    Im a Discordian.
    Instead of praying everyday I spin around in a circle for about 10 minutes straight while I play David Bowie really loud.

    Its really a wonderful way to start the day.
    Ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh? wgah'nagl fhtagn

  5. #75
    Ghost Monkey Soul Vizconde's Avatar
    Join Date
    Sep 2009
    MBTI
    INTP
    Enneagram
    5w4
    Socionics
    ILE
    Posts
    4,474

    Default

    I prayed for a special woman. I think...after a long wait...it might have worked.
    I redact everything I have written or will write on this forum prior to, subsequent with and or after the fact of its writing. For entertainment purposes only and not to be taken seriously nor literally.

    Quote Originally Posted by Edgar View Post
    Spamtar - a strange combination of boorish drunkeness and erudite discussions, or what I call "an Irish academic"

  6. #76
    Analytical Dreamer Coriolis's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2010
    MBTI
    INTJ
    Enneagram
    5w6 sp/sx
    Posts
    17,518

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Katsuni View Post
    Moreso yeu do a disservice to god by trying to attach human qualities to something which's supposed to be above such XD

    God supposedly has no physical form, no hormones running through his brain, and no gender in general as he doesn't need to procreate with himself.

    etc. .
    I agree with you to large extent. The explanation below reflects my own personal beliefs.

    The reality of deity likely transcends all human distinctions of gender, race, age, physical appearance, etc. It can be hard, however, for us humans to fully appreciate the divine in this way. It is often easier to relate to deity using familiar human constructs. One must be careful in doing this, however, not to place limits on what the divine actually is. One particular aspect of deity may speak to, or inspire, or comfort us most at a given time in our life, and it is fine to focus on that; but others will relate to other aspects.

    That being said, the world as God created it contains fundamental dualities. Male and female are one pair; some others are darkness and light, age and youth, action and reception. Much meaning and creativity come from how the elements in each pair combine. Human procreation is just one example. I see these dualities in the divine, and part of the divine creative process as well. In this sense, male and female is much more than a physical distinction, it is an aspect of basic archetypes, threaded through all of creation by the creator. Perhaps my view is more that deity encompasses all of these distinctions, and more that we cannot imagine, rather than that deity is beyond or free of them. This idea of encompassing apparent contradictions or dualities is well expressed in The Thunder, Perfect Mind from the Hag Hammadi Library:

    The Thunder, Perfect Mind -- The Nag Hammadi Library

    As for the male pronoun, I disagree about its usage. It just connotes maleness too strongly. I suppose we could all get used to using "it". After all, in other languages, the neuter pronoun is used to refer to animate "objects", even people. My preference is to alternate the use of "he" and "she", not word by word or sentence by sentence, but perhaps chapter by chapter (as in a book), or service by service (as at church). One might use "she" when referencing aspects of deity that are archetypically feminine, and "he" for those that are masculine, but always with the knowledge that there are far from absolute in describing humans, and just a loose approximation in describing deity.

  7. #77
    Priestess Of Syrinx Katsuni's Avatar
    Join Date
    Aug 2009
    MBTI
    ENTP
    Enneagram
    3w4?
    Posts
    1,238

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Coriolis View Post
    That being said, the world as God created it contains fundamental dualities. Male and female are one pair; some others are darkness and light, age and youth, action and reception. Much meaning and creativity come from how the elements in each pair combine. Human procreation is just one example. I see these dualities in the divine, and part of the divine creative process as well. In this sense, male and female is much more than a physical distinction, it is an aspect of basic archetypes, threaded through all of creation by the creator. Perhaps my view is more that deity encompasses all of these distinctions, and more that we cannot imagine, rather than that deity is beyond or free of them. This idea of encompassing apparent contradictions or dualities is well expressed in The Thunder, Perfect Mind from the Hag Hammadi Library:
    Alot of these aren't true dualities however, and from the look of the way things are set up, if god really DID make everything, I think he realized that manually building each and every single individual thing one at a time was really monotonous, and he may have infinite everything else, but he definitely doesn't have infinite patience, as has been shown repeatedly in holy texts everywhere.

    As such, it seems more likely that the ONLY reason we have two genders, is because he wanted us to be able to do the procreation thing on our own, and rather than spin a dice, he wanted it based off the one procreating, but didn't want carbon copy clones every time, so went with two genders.

    There's actually quite a few things WITHOUT gender... and many with breed asexually with themselves, or just split, including many invertebrates and most any simple or single celled organisms.

    But it's normal to see a 'pattern' like dualities... it's pretty hard not for there to be some things which are dual in nature. Whot's more interesting, is yeu are FAR from the first to think of this... but actually quite differently; almost every single religion, myth and culture, at some point, has considered the number 3 to be holy, or massively significant. Many cultures made their entire numeric system on base 3 instead of base 10 like we do today. Egyptians, mayans, and many others, all used a base 3 counting system because it was holy. There's many other examples of 3 being of significance as well, but the easiest to think of since I just woke up, is "the holy trinity"; god the father, god the son, god the holy spirit (wth's with the holy spirit anyway? And why's 'the father' different? O.o )

    Regardless, the concepts of splitting things into groups of 2 or 3 as significant has been around a long time, and I think it's less so that god himself is a duality, or a trinity, than it is that people just like to group things into patterns they see, and 2 and 3 are really, really easy to see patterns, so they're everywhere.

  8. #78
    & Badger, Ratty and Toad Mole's Avatar
    Join Date
    Mar 2008
    Posts
    18,524

    Smile Prayer and the Enlightenment

    Quote Originally Posted by Katsuni View Post
    ...it is that people just like to group things into patterns they see [and it's] really easy to see patterns, so they're everywhere.
    Or we might say we are meaning creating animals who see patterns everywhere.

    However since the Enlightenment in the 17th and 18th Centuries, we have learnt to test patterns against reality.

    Some patterns we find fit reality and some don't.

    And it is the testing of patterns against reality that is our greatest discovery and it is called the scientific method.

    We have been praying to ten thousand Gods over the last two hundred thousand years, and we have developed the most intricate patterns of prayer and worship.

    But when we put the pattern of prayer against reality, we find it doesn't fit.

    This can be disorientating, cognitively dissonant or enlightening.

    Perhaps first it is disorientating, then cognitively dissonant then finally enlightening due to the Enlightenment.

  9. #79
    @.~*virinaĉo*~.@ Totenkindly's Avatar
    Join Date
    Apr 2007
    MBTI
    FREE
    Enneagram
    594 sx/sp
    Socionics
    LII Ne
    Posts
    42,333

    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by spamtar View Post
    I prayed for a special woman. I think...after a long wait...it might have worked.
    Ugh, that reminds me too much of that old lousy joke:

    Friend: Hey, why so glum?
    Guy: I was praying for the perfect woman... and I found her.
    Friend: What's so bad about that?
    Guy: She was praying for the perfect man.
    "Hey Capa -- We're only stardust." ~ "Sunshine"

    “Pleasure to me is wonder—the unexplored, the unexpected, the thing that is hidden and the changeless thing that lurks behind superficial mutability. To trace the remote in the immediate; the eternal in the ephemeral; the past in the present; the infinite in the finite; these are to me the springs of delight and beauty.” ~ H.P. Lovecraft

  10. #80
    Oberon
    Guest

    Default

    I actually heard a preacher say from the pulpit once that God would never match you up with the perfect mate. "He won't do that because he's a loving God... and he loves that perfect mate WAY too much to hook 'em up with a second-rate mess like you!"

Similar Threads

  1. Prayer Request Thread
    By Jeffster in forum Philosophy and Spirituality
    Replies: 140
    Last Post: 09-08-2017, 09:26 PM
  2. MBTI prayers
    By Economica in forum The Bonfire
    Replies: 77
    Last Post: 08-28-2014, 12:57 PM
  3. Replies: 23
    Last Post: 07-17-2011, 07:44 PM
  4. Scary Bedtime Prayer
    By MissMurder in forum The Fluff Zone
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: 01-21-2009, 05:54 PM
  5. Prayers by the Lake - for those interested in Eastern Christian mysticism
    By Sniffles in forum Philosophy and Spirituality
    Replies: 31
    Last Post: 12-02-2008, 04:51 PM

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
Single Sign On provided by vBSSO