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  1. #11
    ^He pronks, too! Magic Poriferan's Avatar
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    One of a handful of reasons I am not inclined to be a Buddhist.
    Go to sleep, iguana.


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    INTP. Type 1>6>5. sx/sp.
    Live and let live will just amount to might makes right

  2. #12
    Senior Member ThatsWhatHeSaid's Avatar
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    No no no no no no no...

    You can have love. Buddha said don't obsess over it and hang your self-worth on anything. Own your own self-worth. So, if relationships come, that's fine, but if they go, let them go. Don't attach to them and obsess over them because if you do, you'll be unhappy. If you can genuinely let things come and go in your life and not get tripped up by them, that's fine. Sensual pleasure comes, it comes; it goes, it goes. Buddhism would encourage you not to fixate upon it. AVOIDING IT, like your OP suggests, would be a form of fixation, just in the other direction. This is why Buddhism is called the Middle Way. You neither pursue nor avoid pleasure and pain, but accept them and move on. (I'm not criticizing you at all, btw.)

    There's a book called Open to Desire by...argh...google it. I believe it addresses this topic. Jack Kornfield, John Kabat-Zinn, Trudy Goodman, Bonnie What'sherface, they all are married or have significant others. The issue for a Buddhist isn't whether or not to get married, but what type of relationship to form to that person and how the nature of that relationship may interfere with other responsibilities and priorities you might have (like saving all beings from suffering, but that's not an issue you raised in your OP).

    Cheers.

  3. #13
    Senior Member ThatsWhatHeSaid's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott N Denver View Post
    Non-attachment would come in more along the lines of "accepting people for who they are" instead of trying to change them or wish they were different, and also "being in the current moment" and enjoying your experience right now, instead of living in the past or spending all of your time fantasizing about how the future might be.
    Yes, and not trying to possess the person and incorporate them into your self-concept, i.e., considering them a possession that makes you a valuable person.

    I'm glad to see that we end up seeing things the same way. I tend to read everyone's reply after posting my own thoughts, and in this case, read your response after authoring my own. It's reassuring. Cheers, Scott.

  4. #14
    a scream in a vortex nanook's Avatar
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    buddhism deals with the reality of the human condition. to ignore buddhism is to ignore reality. that is certainly a valid path. many people have gone there. some people get abducted by aliens. samsara is Big Fun.

  5. #15
    Senior Member Scott N Denver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by xNTP View Post
    Yes, and not trying to possess the person and incorporate them into your self-concept, i.e., considering them a possession that makes you a valuable person.

    I'm glad to see that we end up seeing things the same way. I tend to read everyone's reply after posting my own thoughts, and in this case, read your response after authoring my own. It's reassuring. Cheers, Scott.
    I'm really liking the content of your postings on these buddhism-related threads, I want you to know. I often say something in a condensed manner, based upon recollections. You elaborate those things more though, which i think is more helpful for other readers.

    Do you feel like other people are really mis-interpreting or mis-understanding Buddhism here? I'm definitely feeling that way. In short, I think people are seeing it as a philosophy, or else similar to some philosophy, and then just leaving it at that. To be fair, many of the things they are saying ARE common misinterpretations. At least with, say, Hinduism, its usually clear to people that they don't know much about what they are talking about...

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by Scott N Denver View Post
    Do you feel like other people are really mis-interpreting or mis-understanding Buddhism here? I'm definitely feeling that way. In short, I think people are seeing it as a philosophy, or else similar to some philosophy, and then just leaving it at that. To be fair, many of the things they are saying ARE common misinterpretations. At least with, say, Hinduism, its usually clear to people that they don't know much about what they are talking about...
    People often confuse Buddhism and Hinduism I notice. Concerning Buddhism as a philosophy or a religion, well it often depends. Particularly with the differences between Theravada and Mahayana schools for example. I know Tibetan Buddhism more freely mixed itself with native folk beliefs and shamanism.

    You have to take in effect also that many Westerners who practice Buddhism often focus more on its philosophical aspects rather than what we would call its more religious aspects - as one would find in many Asian cultures.

  7. #17
    Senior Member Scott N Denver's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peguy View Post
    People often confuse Buddhism and Hinduism I notice. Concerning Buddhism as a philosophy or a religion, well it often depends. Particularly with the differences between Theravada and Mahayana schools for example. I know Tibetan Buddhism more freely mixed itself with native folk beliefs and shamanism.

    You have to take in effect also that many Westerners who practice Buddhism often focus more on its philosophical aspects rather than what we would call its more religious aspects - as one would find in many Asian cultures.
    Those are both good points. Mahayana/Vajrayana are pretty different from Theravada, and thats part of why I have a hard time knowing how to respond to people's questions here sometimes. Fwiw, my background is thoroughly Mahayana-level, but I've read plenty of Theravada and Vajrayana as well. Also, in China you got a lot of Buddhism-Taoism merging, and much of my perspective is Chinese. Before going to Japan and getting renamed to Zen, it was Chan in China, and had much more Daoist influence.

    To me, I often point out that I "practice" Buddhism [and other things as well.] For other people it may be different, and there are different levels of "practicing" a religion, but for me Buddhism is something I practice. I'm not just saying "I believe ___" or "Buddhism says___", but I take practices and apply them. Meditation stuff, Mahayana stuff. There is definitely plenty of debate about whether Buddhism, and the others, should be called "eastern religions" or "eastern philosophies." Either way, its not "just some philosophy", its something that people can, and many of us do!, practice.

  8. #18
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    Well the Chinese have often been rather syncretistic in their religious-philosophical schools of thought. Although in India Buddhism often merged greatly with Hinudism almost to the point they're not readily distinguishable.

    A rough(though imperfect) analogy I guess would be to some of the various sects of Christianity, and how many people get confused as to the exact differences between them - then trying to distinguish between Catholicism, Orthodoxy, and Protestantism in a general sense and how they interacted with each other over the generations.

  9. #19
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    Speaking of Daoism, I liked this:
    [youtube="yRUv09kEnHo"]<3 Chinese music[/youtube]
    Don't know what cartoon or story this is from though.

  10. #20
    movin melodies kiddykat's Avatar
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    OP- I too bought some Buddhist books, and am a little perplexed with parts of the writings as well. Ex- the idea of 'non-self.' A.k.a. translation- I don't get it.

    I think a lot of the times, what's written about the philosophy in its original context can be lost in translation so easily. I speak a 2nd language, and certain things passed down as words of wisdom, when I translate it into English can sound totally different with meaningful intentions, but the quality of what's said gets watered down, and can't be quite explained the same way..

    Just my theory.

    I'd take the teachings with a grain of salt, until you can actually learn it from a true expert, because after reading portions of it? I sometimes feel even more empty/detached. I think complete detachment from life is a half-lived life. Carl Rogers even studied Buddhism himself, and in the end, he concluded to be happy and self-actualized, it's often that we need to experience the highs and lows it has to offer in order to truly savor our experiences in life.

    Buddha also said to not get too attached to his writings/philosophy. One thing I do LOVE about Buddhism is the fact that it invites you to question all you want about what it stands for, and I agree with the philosophy for the most part. Very peaceful, insightful, and a breath of fresh air for me (considering I grew up with a lot of cramming down of very traditional values not to be questioned but taken for what it is).

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